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YouTube More Likely to Direct Election-Fraud Videos to Users Already Skeptical

nyu.edu

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Re: YouTube More Likely to Direct Election-Fraud Videos to Users Already Skeptical

#31

Post by BitwiseFool »

maxehmookau wrote: post #20
BitwiseFool wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Escape Hatches" sounds like a deceptively benign term for ideologically motivated thought control.

No it doesn't. It sounds like a way to stop otherwise normal-minded folks from slipping down a YouTube-encouraged rabbithole of things that are demonstrably untrue.

I am not at all trying to delve into the topic of the legitimacy of the 2020 election. So, my next question is not an assertion that fraud took place.

When you say "demonstrably untrue", who determines such things? It is usually not the case that one side is entirely and wholly untrue. Losing a court case or having one be dismissed on procedural grounds does not mean the defense or prosecution had no merit whatsoever with their claims.

What is the process for letting people make up their own minds on conflicting evidence? I sense the danger is letting, or even demanding, that private companies make these judgments and filter dissent away from the masses under the guise of safety. I also sense the people calling for such things understand that their own ideological peers are the ones who would be in control of such algorithms.

Re: YouTube More Likely to Direct Election-Fraud Videos to Users Already Skeptical

#32

Post by IceMetalPunk »

hirundo wrote: post #12

Few things make me more fearful of fraud than an insistence that discussion of fraud is beyond the overton window.

Discussion of fraud is not beyond the Overton window. Continued discussion of dangerous ideas which have already been proven false should be, simply because of those two reasons. False balance is bad; false balance when one of the ideas on the scale is dangerous to human beings is worth removing.

Re: YouTube More Likely to Direct Election-Fraud Videos to Users Already Skeptical

#34

Post by calculatte »

snsr wrote: post #11
Ekaros wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They are doing exactly what they were designed and should do. That is showing the user type of content they are interested in. And there is absolutely nothing wrong with it.

Except there is? Mass consumption of this particular flavor of garbage has real consequences.

Like a special flavor of propaganda with political and corporate support that created a movement to burn down cities, loot stores, murder innocent people? That kind of thing?

Re: YouTube More Likely to Direct Election-Fraud Videos to Users Already Skeptical

#35

Post by jwond »

> “Many believe that automated recommendation algorithms have little influence on online ‘echo chambers’ in which users only see content that reaffirms their preexisting views,” observes Bisbee, now an assistant professor at Vanderbilt University.

Really? I was under the impression pretty much everyone was aware that these recommendation algorithms can help reinforce existing views. Discussion around “filter bubbles”[1] was a big thing a few years ago.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Filter_bubble

Re: YouTube More Likely to Direct Election-Fraud Videos to Users Already Skeptical

#36

Post by mrguyorama »

Ekaros wrote: post #8
jjulius wrote: post #2

Well... yeah. That's the whole point of the algorithm - figure out what you're into, and show more of it to you.

They are doing exactly what they were designed and should do. That is showing the user type of content they are interested in. And there is absolutely nothing wrong with it.

The "problem" (if it's real, which I think it is) is that youtube's recommendations don't show you more "skepticism" content, but will continually try to push you further down rabbit holes. It works great if you are learning and suddenly interested in woodworking, but if you don't trust government, it's just going to take you to all the crazy people saying (((they))) are trying to keep you down and that's why your life is bad and you should hate and wish violence upon the people trying to "destroy your way of life".

After owning the same very active youtube account since 2007, youtube finally tried to radicalize me a few months back. I watched a single video from a more radical leftist (I guess class solidarity-ist) channel, and the very next loading of the homepage was at least half extreme leftist and extreme far right channels, trying to tell me that "democrats are trying to kill millions of babies a year" and "republicans are trying to instate a theocracy tomorrow" and "why you shouldn't believe anything (((they))) tell you". Google has known my political affiliation and opinions for over a decade, and still tried to show me OAN stuff, because hey I'm radicalizable right now and that's pretty profitable.

I've watched slightly leftist youtube videos for years now, and youtube never tried to radicalize me, but the second I dipped my toe into the dark and disgusting pool of extremism, that's all youtube wanted to show me. These videos were not meant to inform, but to enrage. The fact of the matter is that extremist content is just way better at activating much more extreme emotional responses, which fun story, leads to more engagement. So the algorithm LOVES pushing people towards extremeism, because it's super effective at doing what Daddy Google tells it to do, which is to get people more "engaged"

Re: YouTube More Likely to Direct Election-Fraud Videos to Users Already Skeptical

#38

Post by [deleted] »

calculatte wrote: post #34
snsr wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except there is? Mass consumption of this particular flavor of garbage has real consequences.

Like a special flavor of propaganda with political and corporate support that created a movement to burn down cities, loot stores, murder innocent people? That kind of thing?

[deleted]

Re: YouTube More Likely to Direct Election-Fraud Videos to Users Already Skeptical

#40

Post by mrguyorama »

jonas21 wrote: post #21
xenospn wrote: post #4

Recommendation engines need to have "escape hatches" to make sure society doesn't unravel at the seams.

What would such an "escape hatch" look like? I sometimes get YouTube recommendations where I think, "why would I ever watch that?" and I either ignore them or mark them as "not interested". Most people probably do the same.

Stores in my state are legally forbidden from selling alcohol to very very drunk people. Casinos in my state are legally required to help problem gamblers get better and to work with them to limit their problem gambling, even to the business's detriment.

Why should ANYONE be allowed to profit from an addiction/slippery slope/radicalization mechanism?

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