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ErgodoxE EZ – an ergonomic keyboard with open source firmware

ergodox-ez.com

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Re: ErgodoxE EZ – an ergonomic keyboard with open source firmware

#51

Post by hosteur »

TakeBlaster16 wrote: post #21
breckenedge wrote: post #6

If you’re interested in ergo, I recommend visiting the ergo keyboard comparison tool [1] to get a sense of how deep this rabbit hole goes. And you can now use YAML to prototype custom layouts via Ergogen [2]. [1] https://jhelvy.shinyapps.io/splitkbcompare/ [2] https://ergogen.cache.works/

I wish there was a showroom or something I could visit to try them all out and see what fits my hands. I don't mind dropping $300 on a keyboard once, but I don't want to buy 10 different keyboards just to try them and then have to sell the ones I don't want.

I agree. However, I find that you can find a few used off of ebay. And also, they seem to hold their resale value pretty well. So you can buy one and see if it works for you and then sell it if you regret.

I think the problem with a showroom is that you really need to invest at least a week or two to get used to the split keyboard. But for me, it was totally worth it.

Re: ErgodoxE EZ – an ergonomic keyboard with open source firmware

#52

Post by Youden »

Does anybody know something similar, with a trackball?

I got interested in these split ergo keyboards when I saw the new Kinesis models [0] but unfortunately they don't ship to my location.

I came across the Charybdis [1] and I loved the idea but I'm not capable enough to assemble it myself and the guy making them has a many week lead time, so I'd love an equivalent.

[0]: https://kinesis-ergo.com/keyboards/advantage360/

[1]: https://bastardkb.com/charybdis/

Re: ErgodoxE EZ – an ergonomic keyboard with open source firmware

#53

Post by hosteur »

lrvick wrote: post #45
TakeBlaster16 wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wish there was a showroom or something I could visit to try them all out and see what fits my hands. I don't mind dropping $300 on a keyboard once, but I don't want to buy 10 different keyboards just to try them and then have to sell the ones I don't want.

FWIIW friends and I have used, bought, and built a lot of these but the build quality and comfort of the Moonlander surpasses everything. Yet to hear anyone that has tried one that switched away from it. It is also the most expensive, but in this case you get what you pay for IMO.

I haven't tried the moonlander. In which ways do you find it superior to the Ergodox EZ? What made me go for the EZ over the moonlander was the extra thumb buttons. Admitted, I do not use those too often, however, they are still quite useful.

Re: ErgodoxE EZ – an ergonomic keyboard with open source firmware

#54

Post by pozol »

daedalus_j wrote: post #49

I've been using split keyboards and the Dvorak layout for many years. Currently using a UHK[1], which I love. I'm curious about the Ortholinear layout though, and how much benefit that confers by itself if you're already using a split keyboard and/or optimized layout. It seems like most people switch all three factors at once, which makes it hard to isolate which ones are the most beneficial. Anyone have any experien…

So I’ve been into mechanical keyboards for about two and a half years now. Here’s how I would roughly rank layout changes I’ve tried

1. Split or unibody split 2. Moving to a smaller form factor (40% keyboard) so that my fingers don’t move nearly as far from the home row) 3. Ortholinear on a non-split board

I’ve tried ortholinear alone, ortho on split, and row staggered on split. I feel like split is the most improvement in comfort for me in general. But, on a split board I do prefer ortho, if that helps. On a non-split board, I’m not sure ortho has a huge effect for me, I use both regularly and don’t notice a big difference.

I honestly may even rank 40% boards as number one, because of how useful having numbers and symbols so close to or on the homerow is for comfort.

So anyway, those are my two cents from my experience

Re: ErgodoxE EZ – an ergonomic keyboard with open source firmware

#55

Post by jbnorth »

patel011393 wrote: post #24

I bought and use two Moonlanders. I’d like future versions to integrate a small trackball and to be wireless. That said, this helped my shoulder and wrist pain tremendously. I recommend it for those with injuries and unique needs. This year, I’m trying the Halmak layout to type even more efficiently. Pair it with an Evoluent mouse or similar vertical mouse for a great setup.

I’m with you on this. I’d love to be able to replace the thumb cluster on one side with a trackball.

Re: ErgodoxE EZ – an ergonomic keyboard with open source firmware

#56

Post by lrvick »

throitallaway wrote: post #44
lrvick wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By contrast friends and I have beat the hell out of our EZs and never had a problem. Way more durable than any of our hand-built Ergodox. That said, I switched to the Moonlander a couple of years ago and can attest the build quality is much higher though. I could hardly see myself using anything else now.

The typing experience itself was pleasurable and solid (although the tenting arms were a little weird.) It wasn't abused/sat on my desk and always had an issue with the cable connecting the halves (I had to play with it sometimes to get one half to be recognized.) Then eventually the right-angle mini USB cable started winking out and requiring me to re-seat it. Maybe I just got a bad unit. Regardless, I was really di…

Never seen these issue on an EZ but they are common issues on Ergodox in general and I have had to resolder the mini-usb connectors a number of times on DIY units as they just do not have a lot of structural support. You do have to baby the connector a bit but everything else takes considerable abuse.

I have no doubt this is why they went with a recessed USB type C on the Moonlander which would take significant force to break.

Re: ErgodoxE EZ – an ergonomic keyboard with open source firmware

#57

Post by hosteur »

Youden wrote: post #52

Does anybody know something similar, with a trackball? I got interested in these split ergo keyboards when I saw the new Kinesis models [0] but unfortunately they don't ship to my location. I came across the Charybdis [1] and I loved the idea but I'm not capable enough to assemble it myself and the guy making them has a many week lead time, so I'd love an equivalent. [0]: https://kinesis-ergo.com/keyboards/advantage3…

I guess there is the Oddball: https://atulloh.github.io/oddball/

Re: ErgodoxE EZ – an ergonomic keyboard with open source firmware

#58

Post by goosedragons »

daedalus_j wrote: post #49

I've been using split keyboards and the Dvorak layout for many years. Currently using a UHK[1], which I love. I'm curious about the Ortholinear layout though, and how much benefit that confers by itself if you're already using a split keyboard and/or optimized layout. It seems like most people switch all three factors at once, which makes it hard to isolate which ones are the most beneficial. Anyone have any experien…

I was previously using split staggered ergo keyboards before I switched to the Kinesis Advantage 2. I feel like ortholinear (well columnar staggered or whatever technically) is an improvement. Not as much as thumb clusters/full programmability though. One place where it is super nice is using uiojklm,. as a number pad. With staggered that just feels SUPER weird. I did also stuff a Japanese in my Thinkpad to get extra thumb keys and as close to the layout I'm using on the Kinesis as possible (thanks to software like keyd/kmonad making layering an option) so I do have some comparison there.

Re: ErgodoxE EZ – an ergonomic keyboard with open source firmware

#59

Post by lrvick »

Youden wrote: post #52

Does anybody know something similar, with a trackball? I got interested in these split ergo keyboards when I saw the new Kinesis models [0] but unfortunately they don't ship to my location. I came across the Charybdis [1] and I loved the idea but I'm not capable enough to assemble it myself and the guy making them has a many week lead time, so I'd love an equivalent. [0]: https://kinesis-ergo.com/keyboards/advantage3…

CST trackballs use a billiard ball sized trackball which seems silly until you try it for a while. Super smooth and smaller movement to get a lot more travel.

Honestly though I consider mice and trackballs a crutch and really only for design work or gaming.

I ditched a mouse at my last office entirely favoring mouse emulation mode on the ergodox, a tiling window manager like i3, and the keyboard driven qutebrowser.

Re: ErgodoxE EZ – an ergonomic keyboard with open source firmware

#60

Post by rgoulter »

daedalus_j wrote: post #49

I've been using split keyboards and the Dvorak layout for many years. Currently using a UHK[1], which I love. I'm curious about the Ortholinear layout though, and how much benefit that confers by itself if you're already using a split keyboard and/or optimized layout. It seems like most people switch all three factors at once, which makes it hard to isolate which ones are the most beneficial. Anyone have any experien…

I'd learned Dvorak years before trying these keyboards. (Eventually gave up, probably by not making the effort to switch the layout back from US).

One minor benefit: the nice thing about external keyboards is the OS layout can be US layout, and you don't have to worry about switching the OS settings.

IMO, being familiar with Dvorak means ortho is an easy transition, since your fingers will already follow a column-discipline. (Whereas, my QWERTY remain hunt & peck; I use ortho with Dvorak, qwerty with row-stagger).

I'd say ortho almost universally goes with with "multiple thumb keys" (2-3 each). This helps a lot with "reduce pinky finger usage, increase thumb usage", since you can move the backspace, enter, escape, tab keys to within reach of the thumb, alongside space. -- Thumb keys also allow for layering, to reduce hand movement from home row.

I think the advantages of asymmetric row-stagger are availability/cost, and its history as the typical keyboard layout. -- If you don't need to share your keyboard with anyone, and can afford a keyboard with straight columns, ortho is nice.

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