Live data from Hacker News

The sports footage you won't see on TV this Thanksgiving

online.wsj.com

71–80 of 106 posts

Re: The sports footage you won't see on TV this Thanksgiving

#71
post #54

If college or Canadian football started doing it and fans responded extremely positively and started asking for/expecting it elsewhere, that could force the NFL's hand a bit. The XFL's crazy wire camera rigs almost immediately made their way into the NFL, so there's at least a little precedent.

Conversely, if the NFL released this footage, competing leagues could analyze NFL tactics and raise their level of play. So it really is a competitive advantage.

Re: The sports footage you won't see on TV this Thanksgiving

#72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's basically the "data", in that when you have the all-22 view, you can extract the full player-locations-at-each-time data set reasonably well using computer-vision techniques. It seems reasonable to believe that that data is potentially valuable and/or sensitive, even if they aren't 100% sure what they want to do with it yet.

That sounds plausible, but what makes NFL so special? Football broadcasts (Champions League, World Cup, etc.) generally show a half to 3/4 field view of the action, only zooming in to show the action on replays. I certainly get the sense that they're trying to show as much of the action as possible.

That's because the NFL is a monopoly. In soccer, if the English leagues unreasonably restricted the views and footage broadcasters could capture, then it would affect their competition with the Spanish, Italian, and German leagues. The standards rise, and those standards are translated over to the international competitions. The leagues are also a lot less powerful, since the clubs are independent businesses and can (and did, in the case of the Premier League) choose to withdraw from existing leagues and start their own.

Soccer also uses a lot more of the field at a time, instead of clustering around the line of scrimmage.

Re: The sports footage you won't see on TV this Thanksgiving

#73
post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> Um, no? There is nothing copyrighted about the on-field action of a football game. All they can do is kick you out of the stadium. The NFL leases exclusive rights to TV stations to broadcast the action. Anyone else who broadcasts the action will get sued and shut down.

His question is what law gives the NFL this right. You can't just claim "I own" this. As far as I know I am allowed to record anything I want. Perhaps not with audio, but I am not aware of any law that gives someone the right to prevent video recording. They have the right to kick you out (if they catch you), but not to prevent recording. If you know of such a law, please post it.

http://www.harvardlawreview.org/media/pdf/united_states_v_ma...

2007 the 2nd circuit upheld an anti-bootlegging law, that prevents people from selling unauthorized recordings of live concerts.

I don't agree with it, but I think that under the law an NFL "performance" might be covered.

Of course the concert is a performance of a copyrighted work so who knows unless the teams are merely "performing" copyrighted written plays?

Re: The sports footage you won't see on TV this Thanksgiving

#75

You can figure out whats happening on the field just from what they show on TV. I wrote an answer on quora on how to do this: What I enjoy in a football game is understanding the strategy thats being carried out and the efficiency of execution on every play. I've broken down a list of positions/schemes/plays to look for below. The following applies when watching a regular play from scrimmage - ie one that will be eit…

As the ball is being snapped: Watch the offensive linemen. If any one of them fires forward and crosses the line of scrimmage, it's a run. If either guard (guys to either side of the center) starts running to one side or the other, the play is almost certainly going that way. If the offensive linemen stand up and move backwards, it's probably a pass. The quarterback and running back do a lot of things to disguise whi…

I know that's the rule, but my question is: how the hell does play-action even work? Can't the defense read the line instead of watching for a handoff?

Re: The sports footage you won't see on TV this Thanksgiving

#76

You can figure out whats happening on the field just from what they show on TV. I wrote an answer on quora on how to do this: What I enjoy in a football game is understanding the strategy thats being carried out and the efficiency of execution on every play. I've broken down a list of positions/schemes/plays to look for below. The following applies when watching a regular play from scrimmage - ie one that will be eit…

This is excellent. Here's a question: Where can I buy the equivalent of this post , but in video form with actual illustrative game footage? I've wanted to see that for some time. Want it for every sport on earth, really. I've thought about trying to watch a bunch of coaching videos for my sport of choice, but was never sure it would help. They aren't designed for me. I don't need to know how to think like an above-a…

Checkout the mgoblog picture pages: http://mgoblog.com/category/tags/picture-pages

The picture pages are college football, not pro, but it is the closest I've seen to what you're asking for. Each post describes the details of a given play, and visually shows you each step. Then, you can watch a video of the play in real time at the end.

Re: The sports footage you won't see on TV this Thanksgiving

#77
post #12

It sounds extremely challenging, but could someone use image detection to process the existing camera angles and use the field markers to recreate an overhead view of the game? If it worked, you could probably use that to do some interesting play analyses over a large number of games.

I think the point isn't specifically about the overhead angle, it's that the existing camera angles don't show some of the players (who may be moving in ways that are relevant to the overall strategy, but their movements aren't sufficiently telegenic to bother showing them on TV).

Re: The sports footage you won't see on TV this Thanksgiving

#78

You can figure out whats happening on the field just from what they show on TV. I wrote an answer on quora on how to do this: What I enjoy in a football game is understanding the strategy thats being carried out and the efficiency of execution on every play. I've broken down a list of positions/schemes/plays to look for below. The following applies when watching a regular play from scrimmage - ie one that will be eit…

This is excellent. Here's a question: Where can I buy the equivalent of this post , but in video form with actual illustrative game footage? I've wanted to see that for some time. Want it for every sport on earth, really. I've thought about trying to watch a bunch of coaching videos for my sport of choice, but was never sure it would help. They aren't designed for me. I don't need to know how to think like an above-a…

Check out this series by Matt Bowen: http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/Inside-the-playbook.html...

A number of posts have diagrams as well as a video. Some of the older posts point to videos that are broken now, but I was able to find most of them with a google search like "2009 Brady 46-yd TD". You'll find the video clips on youtube or NFL.com.

This post on the route tree will help you decipher some of the posts: http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/Inside-the-playbook-the-...

Re: The sports footage you won't see on TV this Thanksgiving

#79
post #64
post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is the legal basis that gives them this ability?

I believe the stadiums as private properties can set rules on what is allowed to be brought in. Most ticket have a disclaimer on the back saying you can't film in the stadium but IANAL. It could just be FUD.

They can limit what you bring in - certainly.

But if you anyway do actually record I don't know of any law supporting their position that you are not allowed to transmit that recording.

Re: The sports footage you won't see on TV this Thanksgiving

#80

You can figure out whats happening on the field just from what they show on TV. I wrote an answer on quora on how to do this: What I enjoy in a football game is understanding the strategy thats being carried out and the efficiency of execution on every play. I've broken down a list of positions/schemes/plays to look for below. The following applies when watching a regular play from scrimmage - ie one that will be eit…

This is excellent. Here's a question: Where can I buy the equivalent of this post , but in video form with actual illustrative game footage? I've wanted to see that for some time. Want it for every sport on earth, really. I've thought about trying to watch a bunch of coaching videos for my sport of choice, but was never sure it would help. They aren't designed for me. I don't need to know how to think like an above-a…

For basketball, there is a very interesting blog here: http://nbaplaybook.com/
Post reply on HN