Steve Jobs emails himself (2010) • Hacker News Board

Re: Steve Jobs emails himself (2010)

#171

Post by xani_ » Thu, Sep 08, 2022, 11:25 AM UTC

pizza234 wrote: post #136

sidcool wrote: post #48

It's a habit of the internet diaspora to label a person either good or bad; binary, with no wiggle room to model the complexity of psychology. Steve, like any other human, is a shade of grey. He did some awful things and some great ones. That's that. It neither makes him a monster nor a saint. It makes him a... Human.

> Steve, like any other human, is a shade of grey. He did some awful things and some great ones. That's that. It neither makes him a monster nor a saint. It makes him a... Human. This statement is a truism; it's valid for every person, and it doesn't contain any information. Based on the information publicly available, my assessment is that he had a narcissistic personality disorder. People with such illness are cert…

It might be truism for you but it evidently isn't for many people that defend their saints and condemn their devils.

Re: Steve Jobs emails himself (2010)

#172

Post by quitit » Thu, Sep 08, 2022, 11:36 AM UTC

elliekelly wrote: post #170

quitit wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

> If you can’t put everything into a tidy little black or white box, your mind explodes. You might do well to exercise your self-awareness muscles a bit more.

The problem here is that I’ve brought up a scenario: people who frame Jobs as 100% one way or another (just like some people frame Apple as one way or another.)

So what do you do? Frame him as one way - in this case in a bad light. Exactly as I stated some people do.

And what? You’re upset that I don’t value your opinion on the matter because you can’t process inconvenient shades of grey.

Sure quote Lisa, I could come back and quote J Ive - because different people have had different experiences with him. It merely proves that shades of grey exist.

Still you seem incapable of seeing that people have different views of him. That perhaps he was good in some ways, awful in others.

Hence why I will never pay any credit to people who can’t look at, and pay appropriate credit to all of the information. Everything exists in a shade of grey.

Anything else is ridiculous.

Re: Steve Jobs emails himself (2010)

#173

Post by DonHopkins » Thu, Sep 08, 2022, 11:37 AM UTC

dbxkcichhdfufu wrote: post #62

sidcool wrote: post #48

It's a habit of the internet diaspora to label a person either good or bad; binary, with no wiggle room to model the complexity of psychology. Steve, like any other human, is a shade of grey. He did some awful things and some great ones. That's that. It neither makes him a monster nor a saint. It makes him a... Human.

Hitler, mao and stalin can all go jump as far as I'm concerned. I'm sure they weren't pure evil either but sometimes people deserve the label.

Admittedly one of the most horrible things about Steve Jobs was that he was good friends with Larry Ellison.

...But at least he wasn't Larry Ellison.

Re: Steve Jobs emails himself (2010)

#174

Post by xtiansimon » Thu, Sep 08, 2022, 11:40 AM UTC

sidcool wrote: post #48

It's a habit of the internet diaspora to label a person either good or bad; binary, with no wiggle room to model the complexity of psychology. Steve, like any other human, is a shade of grey. He did some awful things and some great ones. That's that. It neither makes him a monster nor a saint. It makes him a... Human.

Did you read the same tweet I did in the op?

Re: Steve Jobs emails himself (2010)

#175

Post by kzrdude » Thu, Sep 08, 2022, 11:40 AM UTC

hackernewds wrote: post #114

paganel wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

Or perhaps he left in his own terms. Which is a happier ending than grueling chemotherapy

A was struggling with one thought today, about my own resistance to medical therapy.

A healthy body does not need medication.

Yes or no? Or does medication make one healthy? There's not supposed to be an easy answer. I have some "heavy" duty ongoing medication I'm sad to depend on. (Let's not exaggerate though)

Re: Steve Jobs emails himself (2010)

#176

Post by AshamedCaptain » Thu, Sep 08, 2022, 11:41 AM UTC

LewisVerstappen wrote: post #108

dbxkcichhdfufu wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hitler, mao and stalin can all go jump as far as I'm concerned. I'm sure they weren't pure evil either but sometimes people deserve the label.

In what universe is Steve Jobs in the same category as dictators who killed tens of millions of people?

In NO way anyone is making a comparison of Steve Jobs to a dictator. The original post was claiming:

> It's a habit of the internet diaspora to label a person either good or bad

> Steve, like any other human, is a shade of grey.

i.e. the completely correct but also completely useless claim that there is no person who is absolutely evil or absolutely good . What the analogy is trying to do here is to say "OK, so you don't think Hitler is absolutely evil?", not "OK, so you don't think Steve Jobs is Hitler?".

Re: Steve Jobs emails himself (2010)

#177

Post by gjulianm » Thu, Sep 08, 2022, 11:42 AM UTC

hackernewds wrote: post #114

paganel wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

Or perhaps he left in his own terms. Which is a happier ending than grueling chemotherapy

Jobs had a pancreatic cancer with a very good chance of complete cure via surgery and chemotherapy. I think that a cure would have been a happier ending than suffering and dying from pancreatic cancer.

Re: Steve Jobs emails himself (2010)

#178

Post by quitit » Thu, Sep 08, 2022, 11:43 AM UTC

junon wrote: post #169

quitit wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

This isn't how dialog on Hacker News works.

I see you write this a lot. You also spend a lot of time throwing stones from your glasshouse.

Change comes from within.

Re: Steve Jobs emails himself (2010)

#179

Post by gjulianm » Thu, Sep 08, 2022, 11:44 AM UTC

kzrdude wrote: post #175

hackernewds wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or perhaps he left in his own terms. Which is a happier ending than grueling chemotherapy

A was struggling with one thought today, about my own resistance to medical therapy. A healthy body does not need medication. Yes or no? Or does medication make one healthy? There's not supposed to be an easy answer. I have some "heavy" duty ongoing medication I'm sad to depend on. (Let's not exaggerate though)

Medication can make one healthy. It can cure, prevent or control many diseases and conditions. Of course it's better to not need that medication, but when you need it it's better to take it than not.

Re: Steve Jobs emails himself (2010)

#180

Post by gorgoiler » Thu, Sep 08, 2022, 11:48 AM UTC

I have never resolved my conflict between a Christian love for my fellow human and being very fast to lose my temper with strangers. I wish I could swing to the former and away from the latter.

I feel it is rooted in a spidey-sense for detecting when people around me lack humility or competence. I am completely useless at so many things, I am self aware of this, and while I want to get better I am realistic about it never being likely to happen. I seem to encounter a significant minority of people who are not like this.

I wonder what event in Jobs’ life he was responding to.