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Why companies are interested in Myers-Briggs types

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Re: Why companies are interested in Myers-Briggs types

#121

Post by exclusiv »

biomcgary wrote: post #36

When I was managing, I informally typed people during the interview process, which was very helpful in predicting both how they would interact with other team members and how they would do at particular tasks. However, I learned not to rely on self-reported personality types or tests, which are often answered aspirationally, not realistically. To me, MBTI or Big 5 (not the actual tests, but their framing of aspects o…

I've used strengthsfinder before (after hiring, haven't used it before) and it's helpful for team composition and for understanding who might be good AND also interested in certain things.

Not a huge sample size, but everyone has agreed on the output of their tests. Only in a few instances (like 1 of the strengths for a few people) were there surprises, (ex: Woo under Influencing) but they understood why it was a top strength and how it did make sense even though they wouldn't have chosen that for themselves if they were tasked with picking their top 5 strengths from the list instead of doing the test.

I don't like the personality tests at all. A strong team IMO should have a mix of personalities and strengths and I prefer to build teams based on just a few core values. From that approach, I've gotten a great mix of both personalities and strengths organically.

I could see maybe some teams using personality tests (ex: for sales) to architect a desired team type in a specific industry. Research is all over the place though on what's ideal. And can it be trusted as a hiring framework?

There are many other factors to consider. Let's say 5 specific personality traits perform the best in the aggregate in sales for one industry. But then people with those traits may be hard to retain. They may not get along with one another. They may create a toxic environment. There are too many things that are very hard to measure IMO to use that as your framework.

So I don't buy the personality test stuff in general. I suppose it may be a decent data point as your example of avoiding "assigning the wrong task to a person", but a strengths based approach makes more sense for that to me.

Re: Why companies are interested in Myers-Briggs types

#122

Post by colejohnson66 »

greedo wrote: post #96
vlod wrote: post #79

Interestingly, the CIA spy that Lex Fridman had on [0] his podcast said that all the spy agencies use MBTI and that he (interviewee) thinks they are of value. [0] https://youtu.be/T3FC7qIAGZk?t=6127

The list of technologies the CIA has evaluated since it's inception is long and full of quackery.

Without commenting on Meyers-Briggs, the CIA/FBI still use polygraphs during their interviews despite widespread acceptance that it’s useless.

Re: Why companies are interested in Myers-Briggs types

#123

Post by sedatk »

seadan83 wrote: post #119

I'm very skeptical of any information in this article. AFAIK Google never asked the "how many golfballs.." question or similar. To my knowledge, Microsoft notoriously were the ones that asked that kind of question and then stopped asking that perhaps 10 years ago or more. AFAIK if Google ever did ask such a question, it was even before then. Further, I've done the interview process with Google and they do not ask any…

Yeah, Microsoft started to actively discourage such questions in interviews circa 2005.

Re: Why companies are interested in Myers-Briggs types

#124

Post by neilk »

seadan83 wrote: post #119

I'm very skeptical of any information in this article. AFAIK Google never asked the "how many golfballs.." question or similar. To my knowledge, Microsoft notoriously were the ones that asked that kind of question and then stopped asking that perhaps 10 years ago or more. AFAIK if Google ever did ask such a question, it was even before then. Further, I've done the interview process with Google and they do not ask any…

They put Google in the lead paragraph just to hook people's attention. I don't think Google has ever done MBTI or any other standardized personality test.

However, around 2005, I knew of interns who were interviewing for permanent roles and they got brainteaser questions. One of them was something about the expected payoff of bets about removing socks of various colors from a drawer. Another was a variation on the "missionaries and cannibals" problem.

One of the interns failed, despite having delivered lots of value over their tenure there. I and the dev lead were pissed. Good times.

Re: Why companies are interested in Myers-Briggs types

#125

Post by mistrial9 »

themodelplumber wrote: post #85
JohnFen wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> if you are concerned your employer is going to misuse your MBTI type somehow A potential employer will never know what my MBTI type is, so they can't misuse it.

That depends. For example I was trained and tested to meet with a person and determine not only their MBTI type, but also their preferred cognitive processes, without ever talking about personality type with them. The testing was extremely difficult. But the skill is extremely valuable in knowing which questions to ask people as they try to navigate career and life change. You might be surprised to find how easy it i…

physical health conditions, context of the meeting, significant recent events and naturally, drug use, can all skew these kinds of interview classification.. not to mention motive on your part.. lots of good reasons to discard this kind of human classification as psuedo-science IMHO

Re: Why companies are interested in Myers-Briggs types

#126

Post by gilbetron »

Waterluvian wrote: post #41
biomcgary wrote: post #36

When I was managing, I informally typed people during the interview process, which was very helpful in predicting both how they would interact with other team members and how they would do at particular tasks. However, I learned not to rely on self-reported personality types or tests, which are often answered aspirationally, not realistically. To me, MBTI or Big 5 (not the actual tests, but their framing of aspects o…

Better yet, you should scan the shape of each candidate’s skull and use that as a metric to aid in decisionmaking.

No idea why you're flagged or getting so much downvoting, this was a brilliant comment.

Re: Why companies are interested in Myers-Briggs types

#127

Post by themodelplumber »

mistrial9 wrote: post #125
themodelplumber wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That depends. For example I was trained and tested to meet with a person and determine not only their MBTI type, but also their preferred cognitive processes, without ever talking about personality type with them. The testing was extremely difficult. But the skill is extremely valuable in knowing which questions to ask people as they try to navigate career and life change. You might be surprised to find how easy it i…

physical health conditions, context of the meeting, significant recent events and naturally, drug use, can all skew these kinds of interview classification.. not to mention motive on your part.. lots of good reasons to discard this kind of human classification as psuedo-science IMHO

Who is trying to use it as a science? That wasn't mentioned anywhere. Of course there are millions of factors. Usually the interesting ones call for follow-up thinking or discussion, not outright classification...

Re: Why companies are interested in Myers-Briggs types

#128

Post by [deleted] »

ncmncm wrote: post #78

People are always imagining they have "debunked" Myers-Briggs. All they demonstrate is that they didn't understand what it's for. What it's good for is to help you understand how people who think differently than you do are often not wrong. Other people are super great at things you can't hardly do at all, for reasons. Putting people good at X doing Y instead is a formula for dissatisfaction for those putting and tho…

[deleted]

Re: Why companies are interested in Myers-Briggs types

#129

Post by snapdaddy »

I feel like I am the odd one out in that I don't hate MBTI. I would not use them as a measurement of performance or individual worth, but I do think they might have some value as a team-building exercise.

Imagine everyone on a team does a (free, found online, not 'legitimate') test and then spends an hour or two discussing the results. Everyone learns that the developers are not very agreeable (joking! Lighten up!) and that the sales people are extroverted and that we're all quite different but we can all work together to achieve a common goal, or whatever.

I think it's fine so long as you don't claim it it science and that you don't get caught up in it. And it's better than going on a ropes course . . .

Re: Why companies are interested in Myers-Briggs types

#130

Post by heliodor »

YurgenJurgensen wrote: post #48
slothtrop wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The analysis is, but "types" are just preferences/tendencies that everyone has, reflected back from the test. It says "I tend towards introversion or not, being detail-oriented or not" etc. That's it. Mind you, that's of no use to your employer who wants you to do your damn job whatever it happens to be. If you want the job, it's for you.

The types themselves are also nonsense. There's sixteen of them, and all sixteen have significant tendencies in all four axes. It seems extremely unlikely that someone would always have a tendency in every axis all the time, so the types themselves are set up wrong. They're not even acknowledging the possibility of an inconclusive result. It's also easy to see the financial incentive of removing the possibility for s…

To put it more mathematically, personality traits lie on a normal distribution. Most people are in the middle. Myers-Briggs turns traits into binary options, which does not match reality.
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