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IMDB deleted all negative user reviews for The Rings of Power

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Re: IMDB deleted all negative user reviews for The Rings of Power

#831

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dunno. Ask. Listen. Be humble. Have a hypothesis and then do your best to falsify that. Give him all of the charity he needs to refute your guess that he's a bigot. "So you say that there is a convention in Italian literature of depicting other-worldly beings as having freakishly white skin. Would you be ok with the Pinocchio reboot if the same African-descended actress portrayed the fairy, but were instead made up w…

"Would you be ok with the Pinocchio reboot if the same African-descended actress portrayed the fairy, but were instead made up with freakishly white skin?" Including the word "freakishly" is deliberately setting up the expectation that nobody would think that was acceptable. But I'd like to think we should be able to live in a world where if being literally white-coloured was a key component of a character, then yes,…

> "freakishly"

In another post, GP discussed how "wax-like, otherworldly" white skin is a signifier of supernatural goodness. My brain translated that into "freakish". If he had said "ruddy, tends to tan in the sun" or no adjective qualifier, I'd have just in turn said "white" without qualifier.

Re: IMDB deleted all negative user reviews for The Rings of Power

#832

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"If a story requires an LGBT character go for it." every story requires one then, because we exist everywhere. Stories never necessarily require certain traits like that (sometimes) but I'd say it's more that a story requires a character with certain personality traits/backstory and that character can also happen to be a man/woman, gay/straight, any ethnicity as long as it relates to the time period/area. It does rem…

Coincidentally came across a comment by Neil Gaiman today, related to this topic on Reddit: I don't write much about gay sex, as people who have read my book would know. But oddly, I don't read tweet like this and feel to convert. Instead I read it and vaguely wish I'd actually written more about gay sex. (Source: https://old.reddit.com/r/me_irlgbt/comments/x79303/me_irlgbt... ). Isn't it an interesting perspective f…

> For example, I am sure there are more muslims in the USA than there are LGBTs

No, and it's not even close. An estimated 20 million Americans identify as LGBT [1], compared to ~3.5M Muslims [2].

I wonder what might make someone underestimate the number of LGBT people in the US. Maybe... a lack of representation in popular media?

[1] https://thehill.com/changing-america/respect/diversity-inclu...

[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_in_the_United_States

Re: IMDB deleted all negative user reviews for The Rings of Power

#833

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for your perspective. I've got some follow up questions if you don't mind. I understand you don't have issues with stories where there are no black characters. And I totally get that, I don't mind stories where there are no white characters, so the reverse seems true as well. But my question is, do you mind if there were simply no big budget movies or TV shows to ever be centered around black American characte…

>>>do you mind if there were simply no big budget movies or TV shows to ever be centered around black American characters, or portray black American culture in any way? I think those are strange questions, because they aren't the situation we have in America. We have plenty of entertainment content focused on the black experience. Friday franchise, Shaft franchise, Undercover Brother, Black Dynamite, all those terrib…

> Why deprive all the non-white people of their agency? If a non-white culture wants content that better communicates their lived experience, they should produce it themselves

Historically, in the US, they were not allowed to produce it themselves. So many decades went by where they were in fact deprived of their agency.

Not only that, but they were deprived of political, financial and economic agency as well, which means today, they are generally less wealthy, since they missed on decades of opportunities for wealth accumulation.

So in order to produce it themselves today, capital is required, especially if we're talking about big budget production.

The woke argument is that, it seems that some effort from white investors should be made to invest some of their capital to non-white artists, as retribution for all those years where they had their agency taken away.

That's different than the corporatist take, which is simply to appear progressive by checking some diversity boxes in order to get more sales, or protect their brand from backlash or bad press. I reckon that, and it's possible LOTR is of this kind of attempt.

So my question is, do you feel this retribution maybe actually comes with a hidden price? White capital somehow can compromise the work and have clauses that hurt the creative output and maybe ends up making the content worse. Do you feel it isn't necessary? Or do you feel it's a good thing that should help support and kickstart better quality non-white content?

By the way, as I understand, this capital doesn't need to come straight up as budget for a movie production, though it can, but I think it can also be as scholarship, financial aid, talent programs, etc. which can all focus more on non-white artists. It can also be done simply by opening up more roles for non-white artists, which does imply that some characters which maybe were meant to be white or which had non-specified gender/race needs to be made non-white, in order to create more job opportunities for non-white actors for example.

> And this is where a TON of the current-generation BIPOC/LGBT/whatever content falls flat on its face: it fucking sucks.

Does it suck any more/less than similar non BIPOC/LGBT content though? I personally don't feel like it does. I feel there's a similar likelihood of content sucking, no matter if it's trying for diversity, is promoting or made by BIPOC/LGBT or if it isn't. The only difference is there's simply more non-BIPOC/LGBT content being made, so it ends up there's more good content that make it past all the crap.

If for any 10 movies, only 1 is actually good, you'd need a lot more attempt at BIPOC/LGPT movies to get some good ones no?

Re: IMDB deleted all negative user reviews for The Rings of Power

#834

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Coincidentally came across a comment by Neil Gaiman today, related to this topic on Reddit: I don't write much about gay sex, as people who have read my book would know. But oddly, I don't read tweet like this and feel to convert. Instead I read it and vaguely wish I'd actually written more about gay sex. (Source: https://old.reddit.com/r/me_irlgbt/comments/x79303/me_irlgbt... ). Isn't it an interesting perspective f…

> For example, I am sure there are more muslims in the USA than there are LGBTs No, and it's not even close. An estimated 20 million Americans identify as LGBT [1], compared to ~3.5M Muslims [2]. I wonder what might make someone underestimate the number of LGBT people in the US. Maybe... a lack of representation in popular media? [1] https://thehill.com/changing-america/respect/diversity-inclu... [2] https://en.wikip…

Point made. That was interesting - I wasn't aware that the US had so many people who identified as LGBT. Note though that media representation wouldn't have changed that erroneous view of mine because that is a common assumption made out of ignorance. The media showing more LBTQ characters is not going to suddenly enlighten many that there are so many of them.

Re: IMDB deleted all negative user reviews for The Rings of Power

#835
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What does woke have to do with anything?

Did you not watch the episodes that are out?

I've now watched the episodes. Woke still has nothing to do with this.

It more seems like internet trolls are complaining they see a darker skinned person on their TV and the news media is happy to run with that story.

Re: IMDB deleted all negative user reviews for The Rings of Power

#836
...they even use fake text length error messages to prevent you from submitting negative reviews. What I did:

1.) I wrote a review with 5 stars and tried to submit it. There was a red error message saying the text would be below 600 characters so I couldn't submit it.

2.) I copied a lengthy random text into the submission field so it was 1000 characters++ - still the same error message

3.) I switched to a 6 star rating. Suddenly the error message magically disappeared and I could submit it.

4.) I toggled back and forth between 4, 5, 6 and 7 stars. After a few tries I could submit the review with 5/10 on Sept 5th.

5.) I even got a confirmation email with a link where I can track my contribution. Text said "Thank you for your contribution - this item is awaiting processing by our data editors. Estimated processing date - 6 September 2022"

6.) You can guess yourself if my review has been processed... Like all other reviews below 6/10, it doesn't show up on the review page. 6/10 is still the lowest reviews available: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt7631058/reviews?sort=userRating... =>>> Try by yourselves if you experience the same stuff. We've had reports of deleted reviews, too. I guess it's clear that they're manipulating on a large scale. I wouldn't be surprised if the 6.7 overall rating is manipulated, too.

Re: IMDB deleted all negative user reviews for The Rings of Power

#837

To be maybe controversial... I'm still thinking about it, but I do wonder if diverse casting works in European fantasy stories. The problem I have is that it generally pulls me out of the experience/ makes it less immersive. I welcome diverse castings in modern shows (though we don't need every show to follow a template 'diverse' casting). A common counter argument is, well you can suspend your disbelief and imagine…

Vulcans (and the related Romulans) on Star Trek were always very light-skinned; in the original series and TNG they always appeared with white make-up. Then Voyager had Tuvok (who is black) and no one seemed to mind of complained at the time as far as I can recall. I certainly didn't really take notice of it until today when I started thinking about this entire thing. Star Trek: Voyager first aired in 1995, so it's b…

Klingons (which in TOS were obviously supposed to be Soviets) might be an even better comparison: not only did TNG introduce a black Klingon (Worf), but they completely changed how Klingons looked. As far as I can tell, nobody cared -- probably because (past the first season or so) both the show and Michael Dorn were great.

Re: IMDB deleted all negative user reviews for The Rings of Power

#838

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>>>do you mind if there were simply no big budget movies or TV shows to ever be centered around black American characters, or portray black American culture in any way? I think those are strange questions, because they aren't the situation we have in America. We have plenty of entertainment content focused on the black experience. Friday franchise, Shaft franchise, Undercover Brother, Black Dynamite, all those terrib…

> Why deprive all the non-white people of their agency? If a non-white culture wants content that better communicates their lived experience, they should produce it themselves Historically, in the US, they were not allowed to produce it themselves. So many decades went by where they were in fact deprived of their agency. Not only that, but they were deprived of political, financial and economic agency as well, which…

>>>So my question is, do you feel this retribution maybe actually comes with a hidden price? White capital somehow can compromise the work and have clauses that hurt the creative output and maybe ends up making the content worse. Do you feel it isn't necessary? Or do you feel it's a good thing that should help support and kickstart better quality non-white content?

Currently white capital availability is gatekept by socio-political ideology. If you aren't toeing the party line, your endeavors will not be subsidized. So definitely the type of content produced/amplified will be compromised as a consequence.

>>>but I think it can also be as scholarship, financial aid, talent programs, etc. which can all focus more on non-white artists.

The reality is that this subsidizes mediocrity, and we all suffer as a consequence. Blind meritocracy is preferred, IMO. I'll admit this is much harder to get correct with a subjective field such as creative works/art, compared to something like the military or engineering.

>>> in order to create more job opportunities for non-white actors for example

To what end? Is the objective for the labor ratio of content creators to match the demographic breakdown (i.e. black people should be 15% of comic writers and movie creators)? Why aren't we putting as much effort into balancing other career fields, for example, addressing the massive gender disparity in coal mining (~96% males)? We're not equalizing the parts of the economy that are unpleasant, only the prestigious ones (cultural and economic influence). Why?

>>>Does it suck any more/less than similar non BIPOC/LGBT content though? I personally don't feel like it does.

"90% of everything is crap". IMO the difference is that garbage-tier content from straight white men doesn't get signal-boosted the same way. Perfect example, Bruce Willis movies: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cd1eNS9HtXo . This crap gets shipped overseas for a profit, but almost nobody in the US knows or cares about this low-budget trash, despite the formerly A-List star involved.

https://bleedingcool.com/comics/how-do-you-do-fellow-kids-me...

https://boundingintocomics.com/2020/11/30/dc-comics-introduc...

^If these were crowdfunded from the LGBT community, that might make some sense. But they are showcased content from titans in their industry. Why are businesses greenlighting content like this and expecting a positive ROI? Who is doing their market analysis, because this content doesn't move units. And if they aren't expecting to make money on these product lines, then what is their real goal?

>>>If for any 10 movies, only 1 is actually good, you'd need a lot more attempt at BIPOC/LGPT movies to get some good ones no?

I mean....sure. All I'm saying is that it should grow organically, from within the relevant community, with no external subsidy, funding, handouts, or signal-boosting. The 2nd and 3rd order effects of such are worse than doing nothing, IMO. Good discussion and valid thought-provoking questions, I'm gonna peace out.

Re: IMDB deleted all negative user reviews for The Rings of Power

#839

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>From a business point of view having a fanatical core of fans who recommend your show to everyone is why you bought the IP. There are probably more than 10x as many people who remember liking the lotr movies as a kid than who are close enough friends with a member of that fanatical core of Tolkien fans to have the show personally recommended to them and probably many times again as many people who are just generally…

How well is the Star Wars franchise doing these days?

You wouldn't believe it, but fantastical.
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