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Don't ignore the janitor

happychasing.substack.com

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Re: Don't ignore the janitor

#201

Post by LBJsPNS »

m0llusk wrote: post #198

This can also be something of a trap. For some time now I have worked as a housecleaner and there is a common scenario that I have learned to avoid: Clients are friendly and ask how you are. Cleaners then answer honestly about how this is an opportunity for them and hard physical work is all between them and crushing poverty. Clients are generally unprepared for the extreme problems that people living as cleaners may…

Because god knows the rich folks can't have their delicate psyche disturbed by the intrusion of reality. Yes, I know you have a business to run. I also know that if people are allowed to isolate themselves from uncomfortable realities, those realities are likely to continue.

Re: Don't ignore the janitor

#202

Post by weego »

m0llusk wrote: post #198

This can also be something of a trap. For some time now I have worked as a housecleaner and there is a common scenario that I have learned to avoid: Clients are friendly and ask how you are. Cleaners then answer honestly about how this is an opportunity for them and hard physical work is all between them and crushing poverty. Clients are generally unprepared for the extreme problems that people living as cleaners may…

Is this satire? It's brutally on point

Re: Don't ignore the janitor

#203

Post by dakial1 »

Do people here from outside the US think this is the case everywhere? Because I'm from Latin America (more specifically Brazil) and I don't think ignoring the lower paid staff is the status quo. Actually it is considered pretty rude not to at least acknowledge them and say the usual pleasantries (Good Morning, Hey Jon!, etc...).

Having been to the US I'd say I don't think that is a fact everywhere also. In NYC for sure, as people are more transactional with each other, or SV where people are awfully superficial/shallow. But I've been to cities where people are much warmer (from the top of my head, San Diego).

One step further I'd recommend you to do is to sometimes move past from the "automatic pleasantries". For example, when the cashier at the fast food asks you "hello, how are you sir", instead of answering "fine, thanks, I want...." go for "I'm good Jennifer, and you? How are you doing today?". My experience is that this always get people off guard and has a very positive impact of them, as bring them back to a more human (and less transactional) aspect of the interaction.

Re: Don't ignore the janitor

#204

Post by inglor »

m0llusk wrote: post #198

This can also be something of a trap. For some time now I have worked as a housecleaner and there is a common scenario that I have learned to avoid: Clients are friendly and ask how you are. Cleaners then answer honestly about how this is an opportunity for them and hard physical work is all between them and crushing poverty. Clients are generally unprepared for the extreme problems that people living as cleaners may…

I believe a lot of people have a cordial/friendly relationship with their cleaner. I know my cleaner's wife and kids, have helped one of their kids get into coding and them to get access to training (bus-driving school, which they completed, then went back to cleaning because they didn't like the rude commuters).

When I replace an appliance, my kid outgrows his cloths or I replace a laptop they've got second picks (after family) on hand-me-downs.

It's also worth mentioning cleaners make a pretty decent wage here ($20+) and don't live in abject poverty.

It's certainly not a glamorous life (and one some family members worked at at different points in their life) and it's hard work with few options for internal promotion - but it's not that soul-crushing for everyone.

Re: Don't ignore the janitor

#205

Post by inglor »

inglor wrote: post #204
m0llusk wrote: post #198

This can also be something of a trap. For some time now I have worked as a housecleaner and there is a common scenario that I have learned to avoid: Clients are friendly and ask how you are. Cleaners then answer honestly about how this is an opportunity for them and hard physical work is all between them and crushing poverty. Clients are generally unprepared for the extreme problems that people living as cleaners may…

I believe a lot of people have a cordial/friendly relationship with their cleaner. I know my cleaner's wife and kids, have helped one of their kids get into coding and them to get access to training (bus-driving school, which they completed, then went back to cleaning because they didn't like the rude commuters). When I replace an appliance, my kid outgrows his cloths or I replace a laptop they've got second picks (a…

I think a part of it is that good cleaners are in very high demand here and I have an incentive to have a good relationship with them because it helps a lot in getting them to clean my house the way I like and for us to work around their holidays/time off and vice versa.

It's also important to be nice to the cleaner since things become simpler logistically once you trust them with your house key and money to purchase cleaning supplies.

Re: Don't ignore the janitor

#206

Post by kradeelav »

dakial1 wrote: post #203

Do people here from outside the US think this is the case everywhere? Because I'm from Latin America (more specifically Brazil) and I don't think ignoring the lower paid staff is the status quo. Actually it is considered pretty rude not to at least acknowledge them and say the usual pleasantries (Good Morning, Hey Jon!, etc...). Having been to the US I'd say I don't think that is a fact everywhere also. In NYC for su…

Very much agreed ... was raised in a mixed Southern and Spanish household and think this topic is saying a lot more about certain people and casual apathy towards their own fellow people than they probably would like. The line that I was told was to always treat the CEO and the janitor the same (with the understood: because they're humans).

Funnily enough, my Colombian grandfather had a memorable related quip as far as not idolizing others to the other extreme, roughly translated to: "they shit in the pot the same way you do."

Re: Don't ignore the janitor

#207

Post by _vdpp »

tialaramex wrote: post #193

I thought this might be about physical security. If you claim to have a secure working environment, I'm not looking for an unsecured VPN, or an unpatched SSH server, I'm asking who cleans up. The two correct answers are: * Nobody, that's why this place looks like a fucking wreck. * We all take turns, I hate it. If you have cleaners, there is no way that's not a security risk. Firstly you probably pay a contractor, wh…

Vetted custodial staff with security clearances exist! As far as custodial pay goes, having a TS/SCI is probably going to put you in the top tier, it pays to stay out of trouble sometimes.

The security risk is a good reason to follow the advice of the article though - know your people. Also, badging and physical security.

Re: Don't ignore the janitor

#208

Post by hirako2000 »

weego wrote: post #202
m0llusk wrote: post #198

This can also be something of a trap. For some time now I have worked as a housecleaner and there is a common scenario that I have learned to avoid: Clients are friendly and ask how you are. Cleaners then answer honestly about how this is an opportunity for them and hard physical work is all between them and crushing poverty. Clients are generally unprepared for the extreme problems that people living as cleaners may…

Is this satire? It's brutally on point

Got to be satire when mentioning janitors. Can't find a worker to respect more than the janitor. A recurrent character of downfall into hell writings. Satire as well here: https://bit.ly/3KO3e5C

Re: Don't ignore the janitor

#209

Post by m0llusk »

weego wrote: post #202
m0llusk wrote: post #198

This can also be something of a trap. For some time now I have worked as a housecleaner and there is a common scenario that I have learned to avoid: Clients are friendly and ask how you are. Cleaners then answer honestly about how this is an opportunity for them and hard physical work is all between them and crushing poverty. Clients are generally unprepared for the extreme problems that people living as cleaners may…

Is this satire? It's brutally on point

No, it is important. One of the more common scenarios that comes up is the flash of genuine fear clients get when they are informed this cleaning job was the only opportunity the cleaner was able to find after getting out of prison. What should be about them happily receiving service at a reasonable rate turns to dark doubts and a sharply increased rate of not being invited back which is a problem because being invited back and recommended by delighted clients is at the core of success for cleaners who endure.

Re: Don't ignore the janitor

#210

Post by spaetzleesser »

inglor_cz wrote: post #114
lambdasquirrel wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One of the janitors in my high school once gave us a lecture on linear algebra. I don't know what he did before he left the former Warsaw Pact country he was from, but it was one of those whoa kind of experiences.

In the 1990s, when the former USSR had gone to shit, you could meet a lot of menial workers from the ex-Soviet republics who had academic degrees and could hold a conversation to prove it. I studied mathematics in Prague in 1996-2003. More than once I met a janitor or a taxi driver who, albeit with a heavy Russian or Ukrainian accent, knew what a uniformly continuous function was and what does the Chinese Remainder T…

That happened a lot in Germany in the 90s. Lots of russian engineers and PHDs working on the manufacturing floor.
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