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Don't ignore the janitor

happychasing.substack.com

61–70 of 286 posts

Re: Don't ignore the janitor

#61

Further, try to abide by their requests. If they want the trash can by the door to your office or cubicle on Thursday evening, move the damn trashcan to the door. They have 100 to empty; it's a trivial task for you. We can get wound up in ourselves and forget to hold a door, or avoid spilling crumbs on our carpet, or log out of our workstation, or use a different hallway when the floor is being waxed, or to move the…

I do get being nice to janitors--and I am happy to help them with something if asked, and I don't "ignore" them as noted in this article as I definitely agree that's rude to treat them as second-class humans unworthy of being regarded with eye contact or banter--but I am being paid to do my job and they are being paid to their job and if I am spending my time or mental energy doing part of their job then I feel like something in the division of labor has failed. No one wants me spending my time working on the website or managing the social media account, and while every department certainly has something I could add to my task list to make their job easier--such as going out of my way to maintain a high-level changelog of the product or maintain a list of new translation syringe--it is their job to let me do my job, and we hired the people to do the extra work of going back through the work I did and finding those things I didn't write down at the time so I could maximize the time I spend on new development or architecture or debugging or cutting server costs or whatever it is that I was hired to do. I also think there is something to the people who argue that if you go out of your way to put away carts or use self-checkout "to help the people who work there" without realizing that you are REPLACING the people who work there--as, due to your efforts, the company can hire fewer people to do whatever that job is--then you are not actually their friend. While I avoid getting crumbs on the carpet because it is likely to attract ants or cause other forms of permanent damage to the room in the form of ground-in debris or stains, it just isn't clear to me that the most "janitor friendly" action--in the long run--wouldn't be to actively create as large of a mess as I can without people deciding I am myself such a liability that I lose my own job (and one could imagine actually conspiring with the janitorial staff over creating such elaborate "but understandable" messes ;P). Certainly, if we merely move all the trash cans to where they are most quickly gathered, the company would be almost negligent to not assign the janitor some new task to fill the time that was saved (or reduce their hours, or scale down the department, etc.).

Re: Don't ignore the janitor

#62

I feel like trading spaces every month or so with a different employee for a brief period of time would be a really, really positive exercise. If you could arrange it so you can mitigate business disruptions while people fumble around (maybe do whatever is typically done with new hires), I have a feeling the mutual appreciation for what other people contribute would lead to better cooperation. I know there are lots o…

Yeah, there are almost too many reality shows like that, really.

I wouldn't make it a "trading places" thing. I'd like to see a full semester of retail work and a full semester of food service work be a requirement to get a bachelor's degree. I've done both, and for far longer than a semester each. One thing it taught me was to never get angry at someone who's trying to help me.

Re: Don't ignore the janitor

#63
post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Further, try to abide by their requests. If they want the trash can by the door to your office or cubicle on Thursday evening, move the damn trashcan to the door. Better yet, take your damn trashcan out to the damn dumpster your own damn self. Then we can save some damn money and fire the damn janitor. > They have 100 to empty; it's a trivial task for you. It's a trivial part of their job. They're getting paid for…

In Japanese schools, the kids are the ones doing the cleaning. Not just taking out the trash, but cleaning the blackboards, mopping the floor, tidying up the desks, cleaning the bathrooms, etc. The reasoning isn't to save money, however. It is precisely to teach them there's no such thing as work that is beneath them.

The idea of replicating this in a modern office is quite the amusing image. It strikes me as both true and false:

- no job is truly beneath me, and sometimes I have to wade into the weeds so better be prepared

- it's also a way to just get essentially free or cheap(er) labour by increasing the duties of those whose time would be better spent elsewhere.

Re: Don't ignore the janitor

#64

I ignore the janitor because of the obvious wealth disparity between us. He works just as hard as me but is doing a job nobody likes and is paid less for it. It's completely unfair. And when I just see the janitor it's all I think about. This article is like, be nice to the people you step on. Yeah. I don't disagree with that sentiment.

I agree with the first part of your comment, but as to the last, I think the message the article is trying to send is "Don't step on people."

Re: Don't ignore the janitor

#66
post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In Japanese schools, the kids are the ones doing the cleaning. Not just taking out the trash, but cleaning the blackboards, mopping the floor, tidying up the desks, cleaning the bathrooms, etc. The reasoning isn't to save money, however. It is precisely to teach them there's no such thing as work that is beneath them.

The idea of replicating this in a modern office is quite the amusing image. It strikes me as both true and false: - no job is truly beneath me, and sometimes I have to wade into the weeds so better be prepared - it's also a way to just get essentially free or cheap(er) labour by increasing the duties of those whose time would be better spent elsewhere.

It's not all that different than going home and doing the cooking or the laundry. Surely you don't leave housework to your partner "because your time would be better spent elsewhere", right?

We don't think of brushing our teeth as "wading into the weeds", it's just an integral part of life for us. Cooking and laundry is (hopefully) just as much an integral part of life. Similarly, the Japanese famously don't have public trash bins everywhere and yet their streets are spotless because they consider public space cleanliness an integral part of life.

And one would hope that saying hi to people is an integral part of life too.

Re: Don't ignore the janitor

#67
post #61

Further, try to abide by their requests. If they want the trash can by the door to your office or cubicle on Thursday evening, move the damn trashcan to the door. They have 100 to empty; it's a trivial task for you. We can get wound up in ourselves and forget to hold a door, or avoid spilling crumbs on our carpet, or log out of our workstation, or use a different hallway when the floor is being waxed, or to move the…

I do get being nice to janitors--and I am happy to help them with something if asked, and I don't "ignore" them as noted in this article as I definitely agree that's rude to treat them as second-class humans unworthy of being regarded with eye contact or banter--but I am being paid to do my job and they are being paid to their job and if I am spending my time or mental energy doing part of their job then I feel like…

It's like 10 seconds of your time.

Re: Don't ignore the janitor

#68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Further, try to abide by their requests. If they want the trash can by the door to your office or cubicle on Thursday evening, move the damn trashcan to the door. Better yet, take your damn trashcan out to the damn dumpster your own damn self. Then we can save some damn money and fire the damn janitor. > They have 100 to empty; it's a trivial task for you. It's a trivial part of their job. They're getting paid for…

It’s trivial to correct code formatting. You’re getting paid to code, presumably. What’s the better world: one in which your colleagues make a trivial effort to install a linter and make their code nicely formatted before handing it off, or one in which they don’t bother, say it’s trivial and part of your job for you to correct it, and then threaten to fire you?

It's disheartening how antisocial well paid coders seem to be. I mean that in the most literal way.

Re: Don't ignore the janitor

#69

My father was an elementary school janitor, so I have a different perspective than some. Something I've repeated often: "My dad worked for a living. I just play with computers." Of course, in most offices in my part of the country, and I suspect in many other areas, is that the janitors are often Hispanic, with language being a common barrier. I wouldn't want to speculation about their immigration status, but knowing…

The true test of character is how you treat someone who can't possibly do anything for you (anything big , I mean, not bringing your food). As for the language barrier: a smile is pretty universal.

> Nothing discloses real character like the use of power. It is easy for the weak to be gentle. Most people can bear adversity. But if you wish to know what a man really is, give him power. This is the supreme test. (...) -- Ingersoll
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