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Kiwi Farms is down across all domains as DDoS-Guard terminates service

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Re: Kiwi Farms is down across all domains as DDoS-Guard terminates service

#41

Post by that_guy_iain »

viraptor wrote: post #36
nemo44x wrote: post #28

Real principled stance there from their CEO - 3 days to totally flip-flop? I mean, if your stance is we will ban content we arbitrarily find bad then just state it as such. Put into your agreement terms precisely what is and isn’t allowed. Be consistent. This “conflicted” act makes them look weak and of questionable leadership. Either take a principled stance on speech or put into your terms how you censor speech.

My headcanon is that Price wanted to take a stand, but the legal team actually took a better look at the situation because of the pressure and had a long meeting, explaining to him why it's a really bad idea. I hope we learn what really happened in a few years. Reason: twice I sent messages directly to appropriate teams at (large-companies) with something like "are you aware of what your ceo is doing at (link)" which…

Didn't he previously say he took down the nazi site because they were saying that the reason they weren't taken down was that he agreed with them? That provides the sort of decision making process.

Also, I find it hard to believe that a legal team would all of a sudden decide 3 days after they publically announce they wouldn't remove security services from a customer that one customer who has basically been the same for god only knows how long needs to have those services removed. I honestly, would be surprised if the original announcement hadn't already had input from legal. So if legal thought this customer was so bad, why wouldn't they have it done before they publically say they won't do it.

I think the twitter mobbing of CloudFlare worked.

Re: Kiwi Farms is down across all domains as DDoS-Guard terminates service

#42

Post by fullstop »

nemo44x wrote: post #28

Real principled stance there from their CEO - 3 days to totally flip-flop? I mean, if your stance is we will ban content we arbitrarily find bad then just state it as such. Put into your agreement terms precisely what is and isn’t allowed. Be consistent. This “conflicted” act makes them look weak and of questionable leadership. Either take a principled stance on speech or put into your terms how you censor speech.

Kevin has been hammering on them for many days now, and for good reason.

Everyone has a different line in the sand. For me, a platform designed to promote hate speech crosses that line.

Re: Kiwi Farms is down across all domains as DDoS-Guard terminates service

#43

Post by dale_glass »

tony-allan wrote: post #4

I'm very glad Kiwi Farms is gone. But as a thought experiment, would an IPFS based distributed website survive attacks of this nature? It could be pinned by individual users and gateways and accessed using browser plug-ins. [1] https://ipfs.tech/

I don't think a forum is possible on IPFS?

To my knowledge, it's content addressable, and therefore limited to static content, because if the content of a file change, the URL to it changes.

Re: Kiwi Farms is down across all domains as DDoS-Guard terminates service

#44

Post by oneplane »

worldofmatthew wrote: post #34
oneplane wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Cloudflare and DDOS-Guard allow the booters to exist.

Two sides of the same coin. I was referring to whatever stallman may or may not have been wrong or right about.

Re: Kiwi Farms is down across all domains as DDoS-Guard terminates service

#45

Post by that_guy_iain »

The thing is, it's hard to feel bad for kiwifarms. They seem to be one of the worst sites there are. But freedom of speech/expression/opinions aren't about defending those who speech/expression/opinions you like but all of them.

Personally, I think the site being shutdown is a good thing. But it's hard to look at the fact a few corporations can remove a website from the internet and think this is good for a free and open society.

Re: Kiwi Farms is down across all domains as DDoS-Guard terminates service

#46

Post by flumpcakes »

Borgz wrote: post #32
tomohawk wrote: post #23

Quoted post unavailable.

Maybe if they decide to become platforms exclusively dedicated to harrassment, stop prohibiting and removing that type of content, and actively encourage it. Until then, it doesn't seem likely.

I've browsed through kiwifarms and they seem to say horrible stuff about people but in my sample I haven't seen anyone directing action against someone.

It was a good source of information that was omitted from the press regarding a recent case in the UK about terminal medical care. I saw some nasty comments about the person, but in the few hundred forum pages no calls to action or threats made against the people.

Is writing something horrible about someone in and of itself harassment? I've honestly seen an order of magnitude worse on Facebook/Twitter/social media.

Then again, I've only really read one thread deeply and a few pages on other threads as a sample. Perhaps the place is organising crime as the Cloudflare blog post suggests.

Re: Kiwi Farms is down across all domains as DDoS-Guard terminates service

#47

Post by worldofmatthew »

atdrummond wrote: post #35
bakugo wrote: post #24

Works fine for me on Tor.

Tor won’t go down - for now. Once his host buckles, all belts are off.

There are hosts who don't ask for personal information and won't know they are hosting Kiwifarms if its a Tor hidden service if Josh wants to go that route.

Re: Kiwi Farms is down across all domains as DDoS-Guard terminates service

#48

Post by _dain_ »

Y-bar wrote: post #9
8b16380d wrote: post #6

Stallman is right again…

> Hosting providers MUST be forced to provide a platform for everyone and anyone against the will of the provider. It SHALL NOT matter how many people their customers brag about driving to suicide. Nor should the hosting provider take into consideration harassment campaigns orchestrated by users of their platforms. -- Stallman, probably? /endsarcasm

No post body was provided.

Re: Kiwi Farms is down across all domains as DDoS-Guard terminates service

#49

Post by bouncing »

nemo44x wrote: post #28

Real principled stance there from their CEO - 3 days to totally flip-flop? I mean, if your stance is we will ban content we arbitrarily find bad then just state it as such. Put into your agreement terms precisely what is and isn’t allowed. Be consistent. This “conflicted” act makes them look weak and of questionable leadership. Either take a principled stance on speech or put into your terms how you censor speech.

There's always going to be something of a judgment call though. You might say "this content is against our TOS", but what if that content is in a book? At a bookseller?

You can think of many other examples, but the point is, if you think there's an easy-to-create and easy-to-enforce content policy on the Internet, I think you're mistaken.

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