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Credit Karma fined $3M by FTC for misleading consumers with credit card offers

thefintechtimes.com

81–90 of 112 posts

Re: Credit Karma fined $3M by FTC for misleading consumers with credit card offers

#81

I have zero debt. Absolutely zero. However, I left the States soon after graduating university, and thus also have (had) no credit history there. Since I've been planning to return soon, I've been trying to build a history, so when the time comes, I can get a mortgage loan. The process of building a credit history has been enlightening and frustrating. I'm in the tech world, as most people in this forum is as well. I…

I got an AMEX Platinum Card with no US credit history and no SSN. It was my first US credit card but I'd had a lower tier AMEX card since 2006 in the UK, and AMEX will consider your history with them in other countries if you have no history in the US. 6-12 months after moving to the US and with a newly acquired SSN and no late AMEX payments, I was able to get the Chase Sapphire Reserve card and the Apple Card, which apparently require excellent credit. It's not as hard as you make it out to be

Re: Credit Karma fined $3M by FTC for misleading consumers with credit card offers

#82

I have zero debt. Absolutely zero. However, I left the States soon after graduating university, and thus also have (had) no credit history there. Since I've been planning to return soon, I've been trying to build a history, so when the time comes, I can get a mortgage loan. The process of building a credit history has been enlightening and frustrating. I'm in the tech world, as most people in this forum is as well. I…

I got an AMEX Platinum Card with no US credit history and no SSN. It was my first US credit card but I'd had a lower tier AMEX card since 2006 in the UK, and AMEX will consider your history with them in other countries if you have no history in the US. 6-12 months after moving to the US and with a newly acquired SSN and no late AMEX payments, I was able to get the Chase Sapphire Reserve card and the Apple Card, which…

It's exactly as hard as I have made it out to be _for me_. I don't know what else to tell ya.

Here's a fun read from DHH: https://twitter.com/dhh/status/1192540900393705474

Re: Credit Karma fined $3M by FTC for misleading consumers with credit card offers

#83
Things I think are worth noting:

1. Intuit owns Credit Karma

> Intuit has lobbied extensively against the IRS providing taxpayers with free pre-filled forms, as is the norm in developed countries.[108][11][109]

- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intuit

2. Intuit owns Mailchimp. Mailchump was hacked earlier this year.

> In a scant blog post dated August 12, just two days after the company’s co-founder and long-time CEO Ben Chestnut stepped down, Mailchimp said a recent but undated attack saw threat actors targeting data and information from “crypto-related companies” using phishing and social engineering tactics. A company spokesperson told TechCrunch that 214 Mailchimp accounts were affected by the incident, which comes just months after hackers compromised an internal Mailchimp tool to access information on 300 accounts.

- https://techcrunch.com/2022/08/16/digitalocean-emails-mailch...

I don't know for sure but I believe this could have been prevented by the use of hardware U2F tokens, the cost of which is pretty small compared to the consequences of this breach, which affected DO and others.

On a personal note, I used to have bad credit, and I grew in the habit of regularly checking my credit score on Credit Karma. They used to send me emails telling me to check my credit score, that my score had fallen, or it had risen, and so on. The emails were unnecessary - it was ingrained in me to check the app on a ~weekly basis. Eventually, I realized that my score had been at an acceptable level for years, and I unsubscribed from the mails, deleted the app off of my phone, and stopped checking. In my opinion, this was predatory behavior, preying on the vulnerabilities and insecurities of people like me or people who had it much worse.

To sum up: Intuit is not a good company. They care about making a buck and don't care about the consumer; in fact they actively work against the consumer. I don't understand why the connection between Mailchimp, Credit Karma, and Intuit is not front and center in all of these articles.

Re: Credit Karma fined $3M by FTC for misleading consumers with credit card offers

#84
post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I believe they're self-hosting the ads, so if you can see the page at all, you'll see the ads.

Usually browser based adblockers such as Ublock Origin apply extra logic on top of domains to determine if it's an ad or not and if it should be blocked, and they're usually quite successful.

They could be routinely proxying and renaming the routes for their self-hosted ad network script to fly under the radar.

Sort of what you would do to get your analytics script past UBlock.

Like, use Cloudflare worker or something to proxy your analytics script and it won't get blocked.

Just a thought, far from sure.

Re: Credit Karma fined $3M by FTC for misleading consumers with credit card offers

#85
post #15

>The FTC alleges that the company used claims that consumers were pre-approved and had ’90 per cent odds’ to entice them to apply for offers that, in many instances, they ultimately did not qualify for. I believe CK has inside views to the models^ these companies use, and I wouldn't be surprised to find that 90% is actually very close to reality. However, I can also see why someone taking a hard credit pull would be…

>I wouldn't be surprised to find that 90% is actually very close to reality The FTC press release[1] says "for many offers, almost a third of consumers who applied were in fact denied". That's quite a ways off from 90%. [1] https://www.ftc.gov/news-events/news/press-releases/2022/09/... edit: >Also, Credit Karma gets paid for successful conversions, and maybe ad placement? It doesn't seem like misleading someone got…

This still seems a bit dubious—-90% of people who view the ad being qualified doesn’t mean in any way that 90% of applicants will be successful. If you have more applicants from that bottom 10% pool who click on the ad to proceed, then it would be statistically very easy to end up with a reject rate much higher than 10%.

Re: Credit Karma fined $3M by FTC for misleading consumers with credit card offers

#86
post #68
post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I worked in an industry where we were required to use a bunch of euphemisms throughout our internal documents for just this reason - if we were investigated by the government, all of those documents would be evidence and using words like “war room” would be used as proof of (channeling the DOJ press release team) “anti-competitive actions akin to a war where the enemy would be destroyed, and the defendant would have…

Wouldn't any judge see right through such bullshit?

Antitrust is notoriously hard to prove. It often comes down to intent. Internal documents and how the company talks about business decisions can be enough to sway minds in a situation where you’re trying to convince a judge/jury what the company was thinking.

Clearly if you’re trying to put a competitor out of business then calling it a “team room” won’t matter one bit.

Re: Credit Karma fined $3M by FTC for misleading consumers with credit card offers

#87
Having worked at CK, specifically on personal loans, I'm going to with Hanlon's razor here. (Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity.) Not saying the fine isn't warranted, it is.

CK was a place where things were so complex (perhaps needlessly) you couldn't find anyone to explain what was going on. On this topic, you could ask people on the data team how their models worked (to determine what card or loan offers show to what users) and they seemed to have no idea, they just wanted to put the models in an AB test and see if conversion numbers went up or down.

Aside from this, there was plenty of politicking and ambitious people. Not surprised no one was really paying attention to whether or not they were running afoul of any laws. Also, I'm going to guess they made more than $3M on these mistakes that likely impacted their users' credit scores negatively.

Re: Credit Karma fined $3M by FTC for misleading consumers with credit card offers

#89

Having worked at CK, specifically on personal loans, I'm going to with Hanlon's razor here. ( Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity. ) Not saying the fine isn't warranted, it is. CK was a place where things were so complex (perhaps needlessly) you couldn't find anyone to explain what was going on. On this topic, you could ask people on the data team how their models worked (to dete…

Having worked in CK, I can vouch for the same view about the data science team. It was shocking how bad they were.

Re: Credit Karma fined $3M by FTC for misleading consumers with credit card offers

#90
post #83

Things I think are worth noting: 1. Intuit owns Credit Karma > Intuit has lobbied extensively against the IRS providing taxpayers with free pre-filled forms, as is the norm in developed countries.[108][11][109] - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intuit 2. Intuit owns Mailchimp. Mailchump was hacked earlier this year. > In a scant blog post dated August 12, just two days after the company’s co-founder and long-time CEO B…

Didn’t realize Intuit owned Mailchimp. It one online tool whose UX I hate with a passion. Mint comes close.

What are some good alternatives to Mint for financial account aggregation?

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