Google Pixel 6 still freezes when calling Emergency Services • Hacker News Board

Re: Google Pixel 6 still freezes when calling Emergency Services

#151

Post by dagmx » Sun, Sep 04, 2022, 6:07 PM UTC

bjt2n3904 wrote: post #128

libria wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know the specific law, but FCC does expect a phone to be able to reach 911 (e.g., 911 Act). There must already be a penalizing process or fines in place for manufacturers who fail to meet basic standards. I'm not sure what criminal liability would look like, though. Who do we put in jail? The dev? QA? People who CR'd the bug? The TPM who proposed the feature? The manager who allocated time? The skip who initi…

It's abundantly clear from the replies in this thread that people are thinking emotionally, not rationally. They're pissed off at their phone, and reaching for the biggest stick they can find -- not to fix the problem, but to punish whoever caused it. Likely, they wouldn't even punish the right person, it would just be a scapegoat sacrificed to appease their wrath. Your comment is right on the nose when it comes to t…

I would argue that you’re the one who’s having the emotional reaction , not the rational one, when it comes to involving authorities and legally mandated access to emergency services.

You are clearly unaware of the legal requirements here.

Re: Google Pixel 6 still freezes when calling Emergency Services

#152

Post by michaelmrose » Sun, Sep 04, 2022, 6:12 PM UTC

bjt2n3904 wrote: post #128

libria wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know the specific law, but FCC does expect a phone to be able to reach 911 (e.g., 911 Act). There must already be a penalizing process or fines in place for manufacturers who fail to meet basic standards. I'm not sure what criminal liability would look like, though. Who do we put in jail? The dev? QA? People who CR'd the bug? The TPM who proposed the feature? The manager who allocated time? The skip who initi…

It's abundantly clear from the replies in this thread that people are thinking emotionally, not rationally. They're pissed off at their phone, and reaching for the biggest stick they can find -- not to fix the problem, but to punish whoever caused it. Likely, they wouldn't even punish the right person, it would just be a scapegoat sacrificed to appease their wrath. Your comment is right on the nose when it comes to t…

All phones likely have bugs which could lead to crashes which means it could in theory just happen to experience an issue concurrently with the users attempting to call 911 resulting in a failure. However your base image should have few to zero such bugs and such failures just happening to coincide with an emergency call are or ought to be statistically very unlikely.

The issue is not that a crash could happen its that a specific crash happens specifically when the user tries to place an emergency call triggered by the code that is supposed to run when the user makes such a call making failure statistically much more likely. Worse this has been a known issue since 2021.

People aren't asking for space shuttle quality engineering they are asking for the same statistical probability of failure as any other good quality phone. It is deeply ironic that while you insist others don't know what they are demanding you clearly have no idea what they are demanding.

Re: Google Pixel 6 still freezes when calling Emergency Services

#153

Post by michaelmrose » Sun, Sep 04, 2022, 6:16 PM UTC

bdcravens wrote: post #130

bjt2n3904 wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> criminal prosecution Steady now. I don't think you want that.

As a developer, I worry about this. However, I also don't work on systems that could cause anyone a level of harm resulting in criminal damage. If I did, I'd like to think I'd increase the care I put into my craft 1000x. I realize that's not doable in many companies, and that's the problem. Too many companies taking the "move fast and break things" attitude towards people's lives and safety. This is how you invite th…

It highly probable that you are incapable of increasing the care you put into your craft by 1000x as you no matter your intentions because there isn't 1000x more of you to give.

In anything better processes and consistency beats try harder 7 days a week and twice on Sunday.

Re: Google Pixel 6 still freezes when calling Emergency Services

#154

Post by zibby8 » Sun, Sep 04, 2022, 6:16 PM UTC

LegitShady wrote: post #142

Spooky23 wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just get an iPhone. They are for better or worse the BlackBerry of the 2020s. Samsung is the only rival in terms of hardware. Google lacks the attention span to execute. Everything else is even less baked. I’d experiment with nerdy Android distros with a tablet. I used to have a Linux smartphone (whose name escapes me, which is driving me nuts) back in like 2006/7, it was fun but not a “daily driver”.

Because I want to use a browser with Adblock and iOS won't let me, so it's ruled out from the start. Why would I settle for an expensive device that makes browsing the internet painful? Why would I limit myself to only the software apple will approve? It isn't even in the running and as long as their software policies remain as is, won't be in the running.

iOS supports ad-blockers in Safari.

Re: Google Pixel 6 still freezes when calling Emergency Services

#155

Post by layer8 » Sun, Sep 04, 2022, 6:17 PM UTC

LegitShady wrote: post #142

Spooky23 wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just get an iPhone. They are for better or worse the BlackBerry of the 2020s. Samsung is the only rival in terms of hardware. Google lacks the attention span to execute. Everything else is even less baked. I’d experiment with nerdy Android distros with a tablet. I used to have a Linux smartphone (whose name escapes me, which is driving me nuts) back in like 2006/7, it was fun but not a “daily driver”.

Because I want to use a browser with Adblock and iOS won't let me, so it's ruled out from the start. Why would I settle for an expensive device that makes browsing the internet painful? Why would I limit myself to only the software apple will approve? It isn't even in the running and as long as their software policies remain as is, won't be in the running.

There are adblocker extensions (aka “content blockers”) on iOS that work very well. This has been the case since iOS 9 IIRC, so seven years ago.

Re: Google Pixel 6 still freezes when calling Emergency Services

#156

Post by freeone3000 » Sun, Sep 04, 2022, 6:17 PM UTC

dagmx wrote: post #103

bjt2n3904 wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's unlikely that actual people weren't hurt because of these bugs. Do you want criminal prosecution for actual harm, or for potential harm? America has this habit of reaching for the biggest gun it has to solve problems, or make a statement. It always backfires.

Criminal reports for negligence that can cause death are a thing around the world. Pray tell, how would it backfire to make sure emergency services are always available ?

They are scared that such standards would then be applied to their work.

Re: Google Pixel 6 still freezes when calling Emergency Services

#157

Post by mplewis » Sun, Sep 04, 2022, 6:17 PM UTC

LegitShady wrote: post #142

Spooky23 wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just get an iPhone. They are for better or worse the BlackBerry of the 2020s. Samsung is the only rival in terms of hardware. Google lacks the attention span to execute. Everything else is even less baked. I’d experiment with nerdy Android distros with a tablet. I used to have a Linux smartphone (whose name escapes me, which is driving me nuts) back in like 2006/7, it was fun but not a “daily driver”.

Because I want to use a browser with Adblock and iOS won't let me, so it's ruled out from the start. Why would I settle for an expensive device that makes browsing the internet painful? Why would I limit myself to only the software apple will approve? It isn't even in the running and as long as their software policies remain as is, won't be in the running.

iOS supports adblockers since iOS 9 was released in 2015.

Re: Google Pixel 6 still freezes when calling Emergency Services

#158

Post by sophacles » Sun, Sep 04, 2022, 6:19 PM UTC

bjt2n3904 wrote: post #48

dessant wrote: post #40

The repeated negligence around the handling of Android bugs related to emergency calls should result in criminal prosecution. It's unlikely that actual people weren't hurt because of these bugs. They have known about these issues for years, and they continue to give them the importance of an unresponsive button in Gmail settings. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29492884 https://www.reddit.com/r/GooglePixel/comme…

> criminal prosecution Steady now. I don't think you want that.

Why not? I like the laws that have been passed to ensure that people are able to contact emergency services. I think enforcing those laws is logical, given that they exist and imho they exist for good reason.

Re: Google Pixel 6 still freezes when calling Emergency Services

#159

Post by nextos » Sun, Sep 04, 2022, 6:20 PM UTC

The_Colonel wrote: post #119

dekerta wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I got a Pixel6 in July. Aside from the camera, it is by far the worst phone I've ever owned. I probably experience at least 4 or 5 major crashes every day where the phone becomes unresponsive for a few seconds. Up until now, I've been able to live with the bugs as a moderate inconvenience, but now that I know I could potentially die because of Google's complete lack of QA, I'm going to ditch the phone right away. I'l…

My P6P is also the worst phone I can remember, but unlike you, I also really dislike (main) camera. It oversharpens people's faces to absurd degree in anything but optimal light. Faces are discolored (often gray), wrinkles come up, hair often looks kind of greasy. (for landscapes the camera is pretty good though)

I don't dislike Pixel hardware because it's the only phone supported by GrapheneOS, which makes Android tolerable.

But the software is ridiculous in some regards. I bought an Pixel sometime ago, new in a box from Google, and it took two battery charges to go through a gazillion of OTA updates to get it to the latest Android. I know I could have plugged it in and flashed the latest ROM directly, but is a normal user supposed to do that? It seems that nobody cares at Google.

Aside from this, if you look into the network dump of a brand new Pixel it is scary / amazing how many connections it is doing every day. And nobody knows why it's connecting...

I wish SailfishOS became a bit more polished to be a viable alternative to iOS and Android. It's almost there. It passes the above test with flying colors, it's completely silent. Just an NTP connection every 12 h. The UI is a joy to use, reminiscent of the N9, and a few great indie developers.

Re: Google Pixel 6 still freezes when calling Emergency Services

#160

Post by [deleted] » Sun, Sep 04, 2022, 6:20 PM UTC

LegitShady wrote: post #142

Spooky23 wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just get an iPhone. They are for better or worse the BlackBerry of the 2020s. Samsung is the only rival in terms of hardware. Google lacks the attention span to execute. Everything else is even less baked. I’d experiment with nerdy Android distros with a tablet. I used to have a Linux smartphone (whose name escapes me, which is driving me nuts) back in like 2006/7, it was fun but not a “daily driver”.

Because I want to use a browser with Adblock and iOS won't let me, so it's ruled out from the start. Why would I settle for an expensive device that makes browsing the internet painful? Why would I limit myself to only the software apple will approve? It isn't even in the running and as long as their software policies remain as is, won't be in the running.

[deleted]