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Porsche boss faces software woes keeping VW a step behind Tesla

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Re: Porsche boss faces software woes keeping VW a step behind Tesla

#161
post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

but free , ammaright?

I don’t understand your question. What do you mean by “but free”?

I think the parent comment can be interpreted as "German universities are bad, but free" (the students don't pay tuition fees, or only a trivial amount)

Re: Porsche boss faces software woes keeping VW a step behind Tesla

#162
post #15

I've been following this debacle in the German press and I think there's a structural problem that they will struggle to dig their way out of. And by "they" I don't mean just VW, but much of European industry. Software is simply not valued in Europe, and not because there aren't amazing developers there -- there are many. But software isn't considered important Let's start with cars. Back before cars were just comput…

The part about the mechanical guy being the top dogs seems more to do with the fact that a car must mechanically be safe above all else right? Like, I should be able to drive a car if the software fails. But the mechanical parts and components are the things that cannot fail or have a much lower tolerance to fail. It stems from a culture of not relying on software too much no?

Re: Porsche boss faces software woes keeping VW a step behind Tesla

#163
post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is well worth any Tesla driver's time to spend two minutes reading the list of voice commands. Once you have a grip on the vocabulary and structure you can just tell the car to do what you want for dozens of common tasks. (Hint: It's a "seat warmer", not a "butt heater".) That's the good news, the bad news is that I still haven't figure out how to turn off the stupid cowbell when I accidentally bonk the right leve…

The idea that instead of turning a tactile dial I need to look away from the road to adjust temperature or volume if music, or I need to speak, is unacceptable to me. I consider ut terrible in terms of safety and UI.

> or I need to speak, is unacceptable to me. I consider ut terrible in terms of safety and UI

Speaking is terrible for safety now?

Re: Porsche boss faces software woes keeping VW a step behind Tesla

#164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's a "seat warmer", not a "butt heater". “Heat my ass” works fine for me.

Do Teslas seriously accept that? I guess that’s what being moved to Texas gets you.

I didn’t know it was a requirement to move to Texas to understand the English language.

Re: Porsche boss faces software woes keeping VW a step behind Tesla

#165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh you will still get a car with plenty of software, and the car will depend on it just as much as a Tesla. It's just that it's going to be badly made, buggy and not well integrated.

Perhaps then older German cars.

Those are going to suffer from electronics that flake out after a few years (flickering LED displays etc.) Long-term reliability is simply not a concern for German car manufacturers. You're supposed to buy a new car after a few years.

Re: Porsche boss faces software woes keeping VW a step behind Tesla

#166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Microsoft is in the same boat. Virtually no users of their products are actually their customers. That's how you get away with producing very crappy software, even if you hire the top talent. Such a weird logic. You’re saying that Microsoft produces crappy software even though they hire too talent. And they get away with it because the people who buy it don’t use it (i.e. by extension don’t care if they’re spending…

Microsoft isn’t a top-payer like Google et al.

Sad but true.

Re: Porsche boss faces software woes keeping VW a step behind Tesla

#167
post #25
post #15

I've been following this debacle in the German press and I think there's a structural problem that they will struggle to dig their way out of. And by "they" I don't mean just VW, but much of European industry. Software is simply not valued in Europe, and not because there aren't amazing developers there -- there are many. But software isn't considered important Let's start with cars. Back before cars were just comput…

People should try to reconcile the facts that those outrageously high FAANG salaries occurs because of 1) Near monopoly in that sector 2) Excessive surveillance and tracking users 3) Increasing inequality between haves and have nots. And non-FAANG type IT worker are also paid relatively high at the cost of other workers living perilous lives. So unless Europeans really start cherishing these "values". They are not go…

Sad “zero sum” based view that people in low paying areas force themselves to adopt to pretend they aren’t missing out.

“Oh, all of those people making way more must be immoral.”

Re: Porsche boss faces software woes keeping VW a step behind Tesla

#168
Have you worked on a German car?

If so, you're likely tired of the "German engineering" myth. Most often, you'll find overly complicated, failure-prone designs that are worse than their simpler domestic counterparts. This isn't just in such things as emission control, but even in what you thought were solved mechanical problems generations ago: hood releases and power windows.

I'm not shocked that their software sucks as well. Then again, other cars aren't exactly paragons of software engineering either. Nothing exemplifies that better than the shitshow that is built-in Bluetooth and "infotainment" systems.

Re: Porsche boss faces software woes keeping VW a step behind Tesla

#169
post #20

Producing really good software is really hard. Here's a tip for all the backwards big companies in Europe: pay your software engineers a lot more. Whatever you're paying now, increase it by 2x-3x. If you want the best, you're going to have to pay for it, or you're going to suffer the predictably mediocre results indefinitely (to the benefit of Tesla & Co.; Tesla's sales are now up to $67 billion; that's closing in on…

Not just the software, so many cars don't even have a functional touchscreen while requiring use of it for many core features. Hyundai for example like to use really low quality touch screens that are even slower than my old Nokia's resistive display. What is the point of pan-and-zoom in a GPS maps app if the screen can barely keep up in real-time?

Cars have very high temperature requirements for screens. Cars and their screens must survive very hot and very cold temperatures and last decades. Keep in mind the screen is right there under the sun on a hot day. A fancy beautiful tablet screen would last a very short time under car conditions.

Re: Porsche boss faces software woes keeping VW a step behind Tesla

#170
post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you explain how paying software engineers higher salaries means other people need to live "perilous lives". You could just lower your EBIDTA a bit. Software engineers in the US aren't rich because of janitors being underpaid or something.

But computer programmers are over paid and janitors under paid. It is because if all the computer programmers went away the world would limp on. If all the janitors went away we would be swimming in shit.

If all of the people who could be janitors went away, there would just be nearly no people. Being a janitor isn’t really a special skill.
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