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Blocking Kiwifarms

blog.cloudflare.com

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Re: Blocking Kiwifarms

#731

Post by _vvaw »

_vvaw wrote: post #410
eastdakota wrote: post #391

Reading over the comments I see everyone thinking this is about “free speech.” It is not. It’s about what in the US you’d call “due process” and in all the rest of the world you’d call “rule of law.” Our decision today was that the risk created by the content could not be dealt with in a timely enough matter by the traditional rule of law systems. That’s a failure of the rule of law on two dimensions: we shouldn’t be…

What was the actual threat? Was it posted on Kiwi Farms, or transmitted via another channel?

Kiwi Farms is back on an alternate domain.

Posters in the Keffals thread believe the fake bomb threat was to blame for Cloudflare’s reaction. The account which made the post barely had any other activity on the site. The post itself was removed quickly by moderators. If it’s true that an obvious fake bomb threat which was swiftly removed was the cause for this action, Cloudflare has some hard explaining to do to its remaining customers. Fake anonymous posts and an ideological Twitter mob can apparently DoS your entire operation with Cloudflare.

If the threat was something else, I and other customers would love to learn exactly what it was.

Re: Blocking Kiwifarms

#732

Post by rvz »

benmmurphy wrote: post #533

kiwifarms is back up at https://kiwifarms.ru/

So even when Cloudflare bended the knee, nothing has changed and Kiwifarms is still in service via Tor, .ru and have become even more uncensorable, just like 8kun, 4chan, Gab, etc.

This sounds like a total failure to bring them down, even Cloudflare knows it.

Re: Blocking Kiwifarms

#734

Post by hn2017 »

The fact people here are defending KiwiFarms is very concerting. "Escalating threats and the potential risk for human life has compelled Cloudflare to block Kiwifarms from being accessed through our infrastructure."

Re: Blocking Kiwifarms

#735

Post by schleck8 »

lario9 wrote: post #377

As the Americans learned so painfully in Earth's final century, free flow of information is the only safeguard against tyranny. The once-chained people whose leaders at last lose their grip on information flow will soon burst with freedom and vitality, but the free nation gradually constricting its grip on public discourse has begun its rapid slide into despotism. Beware of he who would deny you access to information…

> Beware of he who would deny you access to information, for in his heart he dreams himself your master.

Isn't Kiwifarms the site which uses their so-called 'lolcows' to 'milk entertainment'? Sounds like a prime example of people dreaming themselves masters.

Re: Blocking Kiwifarms

#736

Post by convery »

philliphaydon wrote: post #723

So with KF being knocked off CF and it’s back online already. What’s the end goal? It seems like this does nothing more than push the forum more underground and hidden. But doesn’t actually solve the issue of them doxing people?

It let's "the good guys" DDoS KF to get some revenge for them archiving their tweets, until a new provider steps in to mitigate it..

Re: Blocking Kiwifarms

#737

Post by yjftsjthsd-h »

lanstin wrote: post #665
yjftsjthsd-h wrote: post #578

> This is an extraordinary decision for us to make and, given Cloudflare's role as an Internet infrastructure provider, a dangerous one that we are not comfortable with. "We'll keep doing it of course, even after we said we wouldn't do it any more." After all, it's been all of 3 days since they wrote, > Just as the telephone company doesn't terminate your line if you say awful, racist, bigoted things, we have conclud…

If you take your phone line and start making a lot of harassing calls with that phone, they will cut you off and tell the police. It does not seem that KF posters wanted the speech there to stay private.

That's besides the point; I'm not personally arguing (here) that CF shouldn't cut people off, I'm pointing out that CF just said that they didn't think they should cut people off, and proceeded to turn around and do that while still saying they shouldn't do it. You can be for or against CF cutting people off, but either way you can be unhappy with them saying one thing and doing another.

Re: Blocking Kiwifarms

#738

Post by SuperNinKenDo »

>Hard cases make bad law. This is a hard case and we would caution anyone from seeing it as setting precedent.

Sorry, but we don't get to have our cake and eat it too. Precedents set precedents. I literally burst out laughing reading this wishful thinking.

Re: Blocking Kiwifarms

#739

Post by schleck8 »

rvz wrote: post #732
benmmurphy wrote: post #533

kiwifarms is back up at https://kiwifarms.ru/

So even when Cloudflare bended the knee, nothing has changed and Kiwifarms is still in service via Tor, .ru and have become even more uncensorable, just like 8kun, 4chan, Gab, etc. This sounds like a total failure to bring them down, even Cloudflare knows it.

Noone actually expected them to stay offline. I guess people expect DDoS Guard to be substantially less resilient again DoS than Cloudflare.

> On 1 June 2021, cyber-intelligence company Group-IB reported that they had found DDoS-Guard's database, containing site IP addresses, names, and payment information along with its full source code, for purchase on a cybercrime black market forum. The authenticity of the allegedly stolen data was unverified.[6][7]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DDoS-Guard

Re: Blocking Kiwifarms

#740

Post by eternalban »

eastdakota wrote: post #391

Reading over the comments I see everyone thinking this is about “free speech.” It is not. It’s about what in the US you’d call “due process” and in all the rest of the world you’d call “rule of law.” Our decision today was that the risk created by the content could not be dealt with in a timely enough matter by the traditional rule of law systems. That’s a failure of the rule of law on two dimensions: we shouldn’t be…

We do not call "rule of law" "due process" in US. Due process is the tempering of the application of law ("Rule of Law") by the state. You start off clouding matters (npi).

> traditional rule of law systems.

As opposed to what, "modern and innovative corporate rule of law systems"?

INAL but I am pretty sure there are all sort of legal actions that can be taken before the entire "due process" is completed.

You are aware, Mr. Prince, that people can be arrested and put in jail ("Rule of Law") and have a court date at a much later date ("Due Process")?

[p.s. for hn]: It's not that I give a fig about wikifarms (which was TIL for me). But this posturing by Cloudflare and framing this as a responsible action in context of 'a broken legal system' (aka "traditional") is too much.

Yes, let's have CEOs of SV companies apply the "Rule of Law" for us. While you are at it, why don't you 'edit' the content that you are 'fronting'? "Traditional editorial systems" are also desperately in need of the wise guidance of CEOs and corporations! /s

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