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Welcome to the new web.

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Re: Welcome to the new web.

#111

Post by quotemstr »

tgrass wrote: post #92

As I write this there are two comments that have been downvoted to the bottom for expressing how difficult the post is to read. They draw attention to the post's textual interface, albeit perhaps sarcastically ("Is the new web better at UX than this? That was painful to look at."). Not only is theirs a serious concern, but it speaks to the main issue of the post, for it reminds us that like web interfaces, even text…

Perhaps not coincidentally, 200 AD was about the time that Rome started to falter: in 235, the "Crisis of the Third Century" permanently wrecked trade, knowledge, and culture. The crisis marked the real beginning of the medieval period, and 476 was too late to do anything about it.

Re: Welcome to the new web.

#112

Post by tgrass »

quotemstr wrote: post #111
tgrass wrote: post #92

As I write this there are two comments that have been downvoted to the bottom for expressing how difficult the post is to read. They draw attention to the post's textual interface, albeit perhaps sarcastically ("Is the new web better at UX than this? That was painful to look at."). Not only is theirs a serious concern, but it speaks to the main issue of the post, for it reminds us that like web interfaces, even text…

Perhaps not coincidentally, 200 AD was about the time that Rome started to falter: in 235, the "Crisis of the Third Century" permanently wrecked trade, knowledge, and culture. The crisis marked the real beginning of the medieval period, and 476 was too late to do anything about it.

Tis true. And if not merely coincidence, it leaves us our choice of interpretation: was it cause or consequence.

Re: Welcome to the new web.

#113

Post by ColdAsIce »

alexhawket wrote: post #42
ColdAsIce wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"People all over Europe have learned to drive cars with manual transmissions - because after the initial pain, the vegetative nervous system kicks in and the wheel, the pedals, the gear switch, all of them become a natural extension, of which you don't think about anymore, just like breathing. And if automatic transmissions are great too, that's because they stay out of your way." This is how it is, every time a user…

Unfortunately it's not possible to "stop" designing web UI as there is no standarzied ui library in html/css. Web apps have been shoehorned into a system that was never intended to behave like an app. Stopping random UI experiments would require a replacement system designed specifically for web apps that access a standard library of controls.

Instead of designing your own button, why not use and let the Browser+OS decide how it will lock? Instead of making your own checkboxes (and the behaviour for it) you can just, you know, use the html chekbox. Instead of designing your own form, and "styling" input fields, and then you need to add "behaviour" to the input fields - which will diverge from the browser+os standard, you can just use and tags.

For the rest of the gui widgets like tabs which dont have a html spec, just style it up as close as you can to _look_ like a tab and make it behave like a link - thats enough.

Look at facebook, their UI is a horrible mess, they have introduced thier own "widgets" and changed behaviour for most of the common widgets, like the scrollbar which suddenly jumps back 40% when it reaches the lowest 10 or 20% or so. So the functionality expected - the scrollbar represents a _finite_ document, suddenly it is infinite. Destroy such "ui" crap with the force of a thousand suns.

It may be good for facebook, they can do so since they have 800 million users, and anyone whom they teach _their_ widgets and ui-interactions is further instilled and locked into their usage platform, but as a webdev of projects with less than 1 million people, you cant do that. Stick to the standard. Dont make your users locked into your widget and your conception of what a button or scrollbar is.

Re: Welcome to the new web.

#114

Post by bzbarsky »

finisterre wrote: post #107
bzbarsky wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I suggest taking a look at http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-GBSGBbc9UtA/TmexwLaJN9I/AAAAAAAAAK... for an indication of Google's current thinking on "open". Google isn't as bad as Facebook, yet. But they're not exactly as "open" as many other organizations either.

Where does that slide come from? Is the rest of the deck available?

It's apparently part of the discovery documents from one of the ongoing lawsuits Google is involved in. You know as much as I do about it now; I have no idea whether the rest is available without looking in court records.
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