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US Government Bans Export of Nvidia A100 and H100 GPUs to China and Russia

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Re: US Government Bans Export of Nvidia A100 and H100 GPUs to China and Russia

#611

Post by LeonTheremin »

Sabinus wrote: post #480
LeonTheremin wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eric Schmidt, the former Google chairman, told Reuters in a recent interview that high-end processors should have kill-switches. “Knowing where the chips go is probably a very good thing. You could for example, on every chip put in essentially a public private key pair, which authenticates it and allows it to work”. hxxps://www.reuters.com/technology/chip-challenge-keeping-western-semiconductors-out-russian-weapons-2…

Your claims would be more believed if you would elaborate and answer people's questions.

I reply as possible. Don't need or expect people to take my word for it, need people to actually investigate what actually is on our chips, whatever their motivation. Consider:

"It's not technically hard to make a device that complies with the FCC that listens to nonpublic bands but then is quietly waiting for some activation trigger to listen to other bands," said Eduardo Rojas, who leads the radio spectrum lab at Embry-Riddle Aeronautical University in Florida. "Technically, it's feasible."

To prove a device had clandestine capabilities, Rojas said, would require technical experts to strip down a device "to the semi-conductor level" and "reverse engineer the design." But, he said, it can be done.

https://www.cnn.com/2022/07/23/politics/fbi-investigation-hu...

One way it can be done:

Ptychographic X-ray Laminography; No trade secret or hardware trojan can hide! https://spectrum.ieee.org/chip-x-ray

Re: US Government Bans Export of Nvidia A100 and H100 GPUs to China and Russia

#612

Post by nomel »

woevdbz wrote: post #300
chii wrote: post #219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

exactly - i think making commercially viable versions available for import into the country do more to disrupt their indigenous industry than banning the tech!

I don't think so. It's a little too convenient for the West to think this way, so there's a duty of skepticism. I think you can look at military stuff (fighter jets, spacecrafts, aircraft carriers), or civilian stuff like EVs, 5G network equipment, and see a clear ability to develop competitive and innovative indigenous technology when the sustained political will is there. It's bootstrapped off of imported platforms…

> fighter jets

Eh, this, and probably others in your list (Nortel breach with 5G is a candidate), weren't really independently developed [1]:

> When the Soviets refused to part with their Su-33 design secrets, China purchased an Su-33 prototype aircraft from Ukraine, dubbed the T-10K-3, and quickly set about reverse engineering it.

> The J-20, ... America’s F-22 Raptor. Plans ... were stolen by a Chinese national named Su Bin, who was sentenced to 46 months in federal prison for his crime.

> Lockheed Martin’s F-35 Joint Strike Fighter was also compromised by Su Bin, leading to China’s J-31 program

I think it will take some time to see if they can become independent. Or, maybe independence doesn't matter! Copy and improve may end up being a successful strategy.

1. https://www.popularmechanics.com/military/aviation/g23303922...

Re: US Government Bans Export of Nvidia A100 and H100 GPUs to China and Russia

#613

Post by eunos »

cycrutchfield wrote: post #571
eunos wrote: post #529

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Theoretically it's supposed to be now (>$10K GDPPc). Yet, 4 years of Trump really wrecked everybody minds. Now those values aren't seen as ideal but surrender to the US. I saw Chinese reaction to the death of Gorby recently, wasnt pleasant. Anyway, Chinese determination to recover Taiwan will not change even if her GDPPc is 50k or more. The quest of national restoration will not be abated by a mere richer country.

Sure, it will be abated by deterrence from a stronger military and international allies.

If UN forces with much better armaments did not deter PVA crossing the Yalu River, I don't think this will

Re: US Government Bans Export of Nvidia A100 and H100 GPUs to China and Russia

#614

Post by butterfly771 »

cycrutchfield wrote: post #405
butterfly771 wrote: post #273

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a Chinese, what I want to say is that populism here has risen rapidly in recent years, the Thucydides trap has been fulfilled again, and a war is basically inevitable. is the United States determined to deal with this earth war? How much are you willing to pay to protect Taiwan?

>is the United States determined to deal with this earth war? How much are you willing to pay to protect Taiwan? A majority of Americans support defending Taiwan from Chinese invasion. How much are the Chinese people willing to pay to attempt the largest amphibious invasion since D-Day while being starved of oil and international trade?

Did Japan ever think that it would be settled by an atomic bomb when it invaded the whole of Asia in World War II? Confrontation at any time is a game, who knows who is the final winner?

Re: US Government Bans Export of Nvidia A100 and H100 GPUs to China and Russia

#615

Post by Bakary »

alphabetting wrote: post #180
withinboredom wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They can’t even get their own companies to restrict the use of their citizen’s data lol.

Allowing US companies to serve people relevant ads and allowing US companies to aid our number one adversary in developing the most potentially dangerous technology humans will every create are two very different things.

As someone from outside either country, neither the US nor China developing AI sounds particularly appealing.

Re: US Government Bans Export of Nvidia A100 and H100 GPUs to China and Russia

#616

Post by Bakary »

DiogenesKynikos wrote: post #585
T-A wrote: post #499

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No. The US acknowledges the Chinese position that Taiwan is part of China. It does not agree with China's claim to sovereignty over Taiwan. https://www.csis.org/analysis/what-us-one-china-policy-and-w...

The US used to agree with Chinese sovereignty over Taiwan, back when the US recognized the Republic of China as the government of China. The US switched its recognition of who represents China from the ROC to the People's Republic of China. Unless the US has now decided that China's sovereign territory has changed, that implies recognition of Taiwan as part of the PRC. This is also the reason why the US simultaneousl…

If hundreds of millions care about it, it would make more sense for the government to keep it as a focal point for the population during economic crises instead of actually invading it.

Re: US Government Bans Export of Nvidia A100 and H100 GPUs to China and Russia

#617

Post by cycrutchfield »

eunos wrote: post #613
cycrutchfield wrote: post #571

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, it will be abated by deterrence from a stronger military and international allies.

If UN forces with much better armaments did not deter PVA crossing the Yalu River, I don't think this will

Got any references from the past 70 years?

Re: US Government Bans Export of Nvidia A100 and H100 GPUs to China and Russia

#618

Post by cycrutchfield »

butterfly771 wrote: post #614
cycrutchfield wrote: post #405

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>is the United States determined to deal with this earth war? How much are you willing to pay to protect Taiwan? A majority of Americans support defending Taiwan from Chinese invasion. How much are the Chinese people willing to pay to attempt the largest amphibious invasion since D-Day while being starved of oil and international trade?

Did Japan ever think that it would be settled by an atomic bomb when it invaded the whole of Asia in World War II? Confrontation at any time is a game, who knows who is the final winner?

Picking a fight with the schoolyard bully can seem tempting, but the bully is a bully for a reason and odds are you get your face caved in.

Re: US Government Bans Export of Nvidia A100 and H100 GPUs to China and Russia

#619

Post by jonnybgood »

immigrantheart wrote: post #604
jonnybgood wrote: post #590

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Compared to the Han Chinese state today, the Native Americans are in a really really really sad state. That’s not what you said. > Han Chinese is the biggest Chinese ethnic make up. Didn’t say they weren’t.

And your point?

There’s no point other than to correct your factually inaccurate statement.

Re: US Government Bans Export of Nvidia A100 and H100 GPUs to China and Russia

#620

Post by Abishek_Muthian »

wildzzz wrote: post #294
obblekk wrote: post #146

This doesn't just ban A100s. It bans those and "any future NVIDIA integrated circuit achieving both peak performance and chip-to-chip I/O performance equal to or greater than thresholds that are roughly equivalent to the A100." It's a ceiling on the performance that can be exported. In an exponentially scaling industry, this is the equivalent of an announcement in advance of a complete ban on competitive products 2-3…

One way that companies get around ITAR and similar regulations for things like space grade components that have radiation tolerant features is to only rad test up to what the limits are. The components are probably much more resilient than what they are specced for but by only declaring the legal limit, companies can still export their products. The foreign buyers can do their own testing to prove the components can…

China would just import the GPUs from black market of countries not facing embargo, Even specific military spec components facing tight scrutiny end up there and other countries facing embargo[1], When Nvidia comes to learn about it they'll just keep quiet until it leaks out.

Not to mention, H100 is itself made in China and it seems Nvidia is allowed to keep building it there[2].

[1] https://www.reuters.com/technology/chip-challenge-keeping-we...

[2] https://www.cnbc.com/2022/09/01/nvidia-says-us-government-al...

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