Google employee resigns after ‘retaliation’ for protesting Israeli contract • Hacker News Board

Re: Google employee resigns after ‘retaliation’ for protesting Israeli contract

#161

Post by qikInNdOutReply » Thu, Sep 01, 2022, 1:44 PM UTC

aqme28 wrote: post #148

qikInNdOutReply wrote: post #63

The world is full of these "conflict" spillovers into civilian life in europe right now. Palastinians vs Israelis (or Jews in general), Kurds vs Turks, Shiits vs Sunnits, Wahabi vs all, Thai Royalists vs Students, CCP controlled student chapters vs those with no family ties to the mainland. Also the remnants of old war and warcrimes, being used in these show up time and time again. Todays japanese are dragged for the…

> Palastinians vs Israelis (or Jews in general Please don't conflate Judaism with Israel. As a Jew against zionism, I have many Palestinian friends and have never experienced any issues. It's a very pernicious and bothersome conflation.

The irony is, that by now the palestinians could be rich, if they would have poured all in education and becoming basically a programming offshore nation for israel. You can not destroy code and if you are industrious, you can IP buyout even your enemies. Singapor comes to mind.

But for the traditional players, eternal conflict is the bread and butter buisness. So here we are.

Re: Google employee resigns after ‘retaliation’ for protesting Israeli contract

#162

Post by numeromancer » Thu, Sep 01, 2022, 1:45 PM UTC

jollofricepeas wrote: post #72

dustincoates wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I grew up in an Evangelical church and I attend a Protestant church now (although not American) and the only place I've ever heard people claim that my fellow congregants believe that about Israel is online from people outside the church. I'm sure you'll be able to find _someone_ who believes it, but it is so weird to see people claiming something as a fact about your church that you've never encountered in nearly 40…

Whoa, I strongly disagree with this. As someone who attended an evangelical, fundamentalist Baptist church as a child (Hyles Anderson), it is very much their view as well as larger groups like Independent and Southern Baptists (the largest Protestant denomination in the United States) that the existence of the nation of Israel and support for it is a precursor for the second coming of Jesus and the fulfillment of God…

No post body was provided.

Re: Google employee resigns after ‘retaliation’ for protesting Israeli contract

#163

Post by miedpo » Thu, Sep 01, 2022, 1:48 PM UTC

johnchristopher wrote: post #108

yodsanklai wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's very very dumb legislation, and I think derives from a very odd facet of belief found in some American Protestant belief systems - that for Jesus to come back, the State of Israel has to exist. I remember reading Bill Clinton's biography. At some point, he mentioned that a pastor told him something along these lines, and that it was an important realisation for him. (I read that years ago, could be slightly wr…

> I found that extremely disturbing that archaic religious beliefs would influence foreign policies. Ahem. > In the winter of 2003, when George Bush and Tony Blair were frantically gathering support for their planned invasion, Professor Thomas Römer, an Old Testament expert at the university of Lausanne, was rung up by the Protestant Federation of France. [..] President Jacques Chirac wanted to know what the hell Pre…

I would imagine President Bush was referring to the prophecy in Revelations 20:7-9. Basically in this case, it means nations who are an enemy to the people of God... not so much crazy talk imho, considering that nations really like to fight each other these days.

Re: Google employee resigns after ‘retaliation’ for protesting Israeli contract

#164

Post by staticman2 » Thu, Sep 01, 2022, 1:52 PM UTC

qsort wrote: post #127

imchillyb wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure if s person is willing to completely ignore reality for pie in the sky…

There are at least three different claims here that I'd like to unpack: 1) "If you really have to pick a belief system to put your faith in, you can do much worse than traditional religion." Now, I'm a lifelong atheist, and atheism is one of the few things I never changed my mind on, but I came to the conclusion that this is probably true: at the very least, traditional religion is a stable belief system that won't d…

The idea that religious people don't have bullshit creeds outside their religion is a false one.

Religious people in America act religious on Sunday and like ruthless, immoral "greed is good" capitalists on Monday, flexibly switching ideologies for their convenience.

Re: Google employee resigns after ‘retaliation’ for protesting Israeli contract

#165

Post by aqme28 » Thu, Sep 01, 2022, 1:55 PM UTC

qikInNdOutReply wrote: post #161

aqme28 wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Palastinians vs Israelis (or Jews in general Please don't conflate Judaism with Israel. As a Jew against zionism, I have many Palestinian friends and have never experienced any issues. It's a very pernicious and bothersome conflation.

The irony is, that by now the palestinians could be rich, if they would have poured all in education and becoming basically a programming offshore nation for israel. You can not destroy code and if you are industrious, you can IP buyout even your enemies. Singapor comes to mind. But for the traditional players, eternal conflict is the bread and butter buisness. So here we are.

I don't really understand the point you're trying to make here. Every country could be relatively better off if they had invested better.

It's also hard to invest in education when your schools are bombed and your children are malnourished.

Re: Google employee resigns after ‘retaliation’ for protesting Israeli contract

#166

Post by pydry » Thu, Sep 01, 2022, 2:07 PM UTC

hackerlight wrote: post #132

pydry wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The guy who beat up a Jew in London screamed "fuck Jews" while he did it. Not shy about his views - like most of your other examples no doubt. There is close to no overlap between these people and the people who take pains to explain for the 15th time to a likely racist skeptic that they dont hate jews it's the state of israel they have a problem with. On the other hand, ive yet to hear a single person who purposeful…

> The guy who beat up a Jew in London screamed "fuck Jews" while he did it > There is close to no overlap between these people and the people who take pains to explain for the 15th time to a likely racist skeptic that they dont hate jews it's the state of israel they have a problem with. Yes, those specific anti-Zionists aren't anti-semites. These are the types of anti-Zionists that you'll find in tech circles who ar…

>Yes, those specific anti-Zionists aren't anti-semites. These are the types of anti-Zionists that you'll find in tech circles who are educated, egalitarian minded people that are cognitively capable of separating the crimes of a state and the ethnic group inside it.

Israel hates these people the most. It's not hard to see why. Random people who attack Jews arent a threat - they get condemned and sent to prison quickly. BDS, on the other hand, has a history of successfully taking down apartheid states.

>That doesn't detract from the observation that there's an intersection and correlation between people who are anti-Zionist and people who are anti-semitic.

It really is curious. Every person I've observed who has tried to make this point has staunchly avoided condemning the publicly stated highly racist views of the President of Israel after I raised them.

It's not a correlation. It's literally 100%, even among people who are supposedly egalitarian and educated.

This does detract from your observation, Im afraid.

There is a very clear anti-zionism correlation to committed anti-racism, and an even higher correlation between being antiracist and those accused of antisemitism who deny it.

One or two nazis holding up a palestinian flag (not somethingk they tend to do a lot) doesnt change that.

Re: Google employee resigns after ‘retaliation’ for protesting Israeli contract

#167

Post by vharuck » Thu, Sep 01, 2022, 2:07 PM UTC

crmd wrote: post #159

It is effortless for me to keep my political opinions airgapped from my work environment. While I emphatically believe my political positions are correct, I know that plenty of people don't agree with me on contentious topics. To bring my politics to work, especially as a senior leader, borders on abuse of power, because my role in the organization would confer unearned authority to my political opinions. I learned t…

The kind of "politics" to avoid at work is the kind you avoid in polite conversation: irrelevant. If one's work has nothing to do with Israel, then talking about it must causes problems. But if the work has an effect on the matter, then it's not just politics, it's work. And work should be talked about at work. That way, the people who make the decisions get relevant information. Politics can be messy, but we have to slog through those messes that fall along our path.

>I"ll never forget how that made me feel, and I hope I never make a young colleague feel the way I did.

That's a good lesson to be aware that power can unintentionally cause chilling effects (like in your experience). But I don't think that applies here, where an employee was trying to influence decision-makers up the hierarchy.

Re: Google employee resigns after ‘retaliation’ for protesting Israeli contract

#168

Post by shakna » Thu, Sep 01, 2022, 2:17 PM UTC

jmorse2 wrote: post #66

shakna wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Whilst I've definitely got the impression, that _most_ people think of it as a shared heritage, I have now and then had a few people quoting the same prophecy from Zechariah as their reasoning. > And it shall happen in that day that I will make Jerusalem a very heavy stone for all peoples; all who would heave it away will surely be cut in pieces, though all nations of the earth are gathered against it - Zechariah 12:…

Possibly closer to the mark in terms of scripture is Ezekiel 38, which specifies that the Jews are to have returned/gathered from exile/dispersion and be living in peace ("unwalled cities") before an invasion/looting from the north. Of course, it only specifies the movement of peoples, not the political configuration of the land.

The same groups of people tend to apply that one to the Yom Kippur war, and treat it as already fulfilled. The thing about Jerusalem having to remain as a heavy stone is more what inspires them to defend it.

Re: Google employee resigns after ‘retaliation’ for protesting Israeli contract

#169

Post by johnchristopher » Thu, Sep 01, 2022, 2:18 PM UTC

a_brawling_boo wrote: post #160

johnchristopher wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I found that extremely disturbing that archaic religious beliefs would influence foreign policies. Ahem. > In the winter of 2003, when George Bush and Tony Blair were frantically gathering support for their planned invasion, Professor Thomas Römer, an Old Testament expert at the university of Lausanne, was rung up by the Protestant Federation of France. [..] President Jacques Chirac wanted to know what the hell Pre…

I'm not saying Bush didn't say that because I don't know, I can believe it. But it seems odd because 1) Gog and Magog are a somewhat well know part of Islamic eschatology, and 2) I pretty sure Google existed at that point in time, but without it I am sure his staff had access to dictionaries and encyclopedias which would have led them to 3) Encyclopedia or web entries on Darbyism or Dispensationalism, easily answerin…

I'd be very worried if international diplomacy fell down to a cabinet member who happened to be well versed in Islamic eschatology or worse, that cabinet members would rely on dictionaries or Wikipedia to understand words or cultural references they don't know.

Calling an expert was the right call.

> France's Ministry of Foreign affairs isn't advising the President on things like this, they don't have subject matter experts?

Seems pretty obvious to me that they wouldn't have experts on every subjects, especially on things like that.

> I'm not saying Bush didn't say that because I don't know, I can believe it. [..] Forgive me, maybe I give governments too much credit or, but seems like an odd article.

There's healthy skepticism and there's something else.

Re: Google employee resigns after ‘retaliation’ for protesting Israeli contract

#170

Post by johnchristopher » Thu, Sep 01, 2022, 2:25 PM UTC

miedpo wrote: post #163

johnchristopher wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I found that extremely disturbing that archaic religious beliefs would influence foreign policies. Ahem. > In the winter of 2003, when George Bush and Tony Blair were frantically gathering support for their planned invasion, Professor Thomas Römer, an Old Testament expert at the university of Lausanne, was rung up by the Protestant Federation of France. [..] President Jacques Chirac wanted to know what the hell Pre…

I would imagine President Bush was referring to the prophecy in Revelations 20:7-9. Basically in this case, it means nations who are an enemy to the people of God... not so much crazy talk imho, considering that nations really like to fight each other these days.

I'd say it's crazy talk when you are using that as an argument (among others, of course) to convince a french president (whose country has a clearer separation between state and church than the US) to go to war.