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D.C.-area startup wants to solve the public bathroom problem

washingtonian.com

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Re: D.C.-area startup wants to solve the public bathroom problem

#11

Post by teddyh »

MonkeyMalarky wrote: post #7
teddyh wrote: post #3

> User IDs are part of Throne’s accountability system: After you use a restroom, you’re asked to rate its cleanliness. Meanwhile, each user gets a “Throne score,” similar to Uber, and repeat offenders who abuse the restroom will be blocked. Weight sensors also track if someone’s been in the bathroom too long. “Very few people create issues in [public] bathrooms, don’t respect that amenity, and then ruin it for the ma…

Seriously though, accountability is the missing thing. If getting banned for consistently making a mess is what it takes to get public bathrooms back, then so be it. There's no excuse for the shit I've seen. I'm tired of being denied amenities because of other peoples' degenerate behaviour.

Some people think that a dictatorship is OK as long as the trains all run on time.

The right way to solve the problem is not to harden the gatekeeping, but to improve society so that gatekeeping becomes unnecessary. But that’s hard, and has no obvious point where someone can extract money.

Re: D.C.-area startup wants to solve the public bathroom problem

#13

Post by jjulius »

mxwsn wrote: post #4

From listening to a podcast or two, my impression is that the Public Bathroom Problem is an economic one. There were many paid public bathrooms in the past in the US, but they were deemed sexist and banned. Then cities didn't want to foot the bill, so they closed many of them. What's this startups' business model?

Took me a while to find how they make money, but I ended up finding this[1] on the most godawful of websites (seriously, either use an adblocker or fucking avoid it entirely, good god)...

>Currently, businesses and other public entities can rent a Throne on a monthly basis, which includes cleaning and servicing. But Heinzelman said the company is also exploring an option to purchase a Throne or to rent a larger volume at once. So far, the startup has raised seed funding primarily from angel investors and will be looking to raise a Series A in mid-2023.

Thanks to that Series-A comment, my pessimistic take is that these will be "public" and "free" for now, and eventually we'll see them implementing monthly fees/subscriptions and/or microtransactions or whathaveyou.

Edit: Seems I'm ignorant in this area and that paid public toilets are against the law in many areas. Still can't help but be pessimistic, though.

[1]https://agadir-group.com/dc-startup-throne-is-bringing-tech-...

Re: D.C.-area startup wants to solve the public bathroom problem

#14

Post by eyelidlessness »

> QR code

Um, solve the public restrooms problem for whom? Granted I’ve been living far from DC for 20 years, but I spent a large chunk of this summer there. Access to public restrooms was the same as it is here in Seattle: only a problem if you’re a street critter. People who can scan QR codes already have plenty of access to restrooms, they just need to at least suggest they’ll buy something. Homeless people and people barely making ends meet need to be able to use a restroom, and they shouldn’t need a smartphone to do that.

Re: D.C.-area startup wants to solve the public bathroom problem

#15

Post by xyzzy123 »

bparsons wrote: post #5

Every six months, some startup guy invents public transit, or some other amenity that has existed for over a 100 years.

A lot of amenities "worked" before because of aggressive social norm enforcement.

For example, people experiencing persistent mental health issues would literally be locked up "for the common good".

I think what we are seeing is people trying to use technology to replace earlier (primarily social) technologies of control like shaming, religious instruction, tighter communities, aggressive policing etc.

It's not the amenities themselves being reinvented, it's new techniques of social control to uphold good behaviour and care for shared resources.

Re: D.C.-area startup wants to solve the public bathroom problem

#16

Post by eyelidlessness »

MonkeyMalarky wrote: post #7
teddyh wrote: post #3

> User IDs are part of Throne’s accountability system: After you use a restroom, you’re asked to rate its cleanliness. Meanwhile, each user gets a “Throne score,” similar to Uber, and repeat offenders who abuse the restroom will be blocked. Weight sensors also track if someone’s been in the bathroom too long. “Very few people create issues in [public] bathrooms, don’t respect that amenity, and then ruin it for the ma…

Seriously though, accountability is the missing thing. If getting banned for consistently making a mess is what it takes to get public bathrooms back, then so be it. There's no excuse for the shit I've seen. I'm tired of being denied amenities because of other peoples' degenerate behaviour.

I’m tired of people being denied basic and non-scarce resources because some people presuppose they’re yucky (even while making people yucky with those presuppositions). If we’re banning anyone from public services, I’d start with those who want to deny those services to people who most need them, in the way most likely to reinforce their biases by denying them access.

Re: D.C.-area startup wants to solve the public bathroom problem

#18

Post by Animats »

In San Francisco JCDeaux already does that. Those units are self-cleaning, handicapped-accessible, and cost about $300K each. They're complicated, with motors, sensors, and valves. All the hardware and controls are Telemechanique industrial grade. SF has a big problem with those. Vandalism, people shooting up inside, people dumping trash in them, etc. There's no problem providing public bathrooms for rich people. It's providing public bathrooms for homeless people that's a problem.

Wheelchair accessibility triples the size and price of the units. Here's what JCDEaux installs in countries that don't require it.[1]

San Francisco has an attended 24 hour portable restroom operation in poor parts of the city, called "Pit Stop". Total operating costs are around $30 per flush.[2]

The most workable low-end solution currently seems to be the Portland Loo.[3] "The sleek and modern kiosk discourages crime with graffiti-proof wall panels and open grating that allows you to see if and how many people are inside." It's not self-cleaning like the expensive JCDeaux units, but it can be hosed down or if necessary pressure-washed.

[1] https://www.jcdecaux.lt/en/news/modern-public-toilet-klaiped...

[2] https://www.businessinsider.com/san-francisco-public-pit-sto...

[3] https://portlandloo.com/

Re: D.C.-area startup wants to solve the public bathroom problem

#19

Post by sokoloff »

eyelidlessness wrote: post #16
MonkeyMalarky wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seriously though, accountability is the missing thing. If getting banned for consistently making a mess is what it takes to get public bathrooms back, then so be it. There's no excuse for the shit I've seen. I'm tired of being denied amenities because of other peoples' degenerate behaviour.

I’m tired of people being denied basic and non-scarce resources because some people presuppose they’re yucky (even while making people yucky with those presuppositions). If we’re banning anyone from public services, I’d start with those who want to deny those services to people who most need them, in the way most likely to reinforce their biases by denying them access.

Unattended, clean, public-accessible restrooms could very well be scarce resources.
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