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At $249 per day, prison stays leave ex-inmates deep in debt

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Re: At $249 per day, prison stays leave ex-inmates deep in debt

#271

Post by kettro »

nightski wrote: post #197
standardUser wrote: post #13

What drives me absolutely insane about stories like this is that so many of the people suffering under these policies are guilty of little more than market participation. The government strains, at extraordinary expense, to pretend they can stop drugs from being made, bought and sold, but they can't. They simply can't. Countless laws, countless billions of dollars and countless ruined lives later, drugs are no less p…

Then why are the places with the least restrictive drug laws arguably where the problem is the worst by a large margin? If these laws don't work at all. Not saying I fully support them or anything, I am just curious what your thoughts are.

I would consider flipping causality. I think those places, typically cities and ports, are disposed to having larger drug populations, be that from abundance of supply or some other factor. Then, those places end up passing lenient laws as a result of the problem, and instead cope via non-criminal programs like safe injection sites.

It’s not like Vancouver or SF decided first to have safe injection sites, and then suddenly had huge heroin problems.

Re: At $249 per day, prison stays leave ex-inmates deep in debt

#272

Post by sillystuff »

TillE wrote: post #206
selectodude wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you ever even taken an opiate?

Seriously, the suggestion that an opiate makes you aggressive is very funny. The high is just like, pure happiness. Also fentanyl is a big thing because opiates are illegal. If people had a choice they'd stick to the good stuff like oxycodone, which is significantly less dangerous.

I assume your experience must be common to explain the prevalence of opioid addiction. But, my experiences are a counter-example-- opioids are not pleasant for everyone.

The first time, I was given an opioid (after surgery) I felt irrationally angry-- as in completely irrational anger at e.g., the color the walls were painted. After snapping at my girlfriend who was being super sweet and supportive, I immediately stopped taking them. This was pills, but I do not recall the name. The angry feeling passed within hours after missing the next dose. The period of apology lasted much longer. I can believe that someone experiencing similar irrational anger could do more than verbally snap at someone.

The second time, was Dilaudid via IV while recovering in hospital (machine with button to press to self-dose when in pain). No bad reaction this time.

I wouldn't describe either experience as euphoric. The first experience was negative and the second, other than helping with pain, was neutral.

Re: At $249 per day, prison stays leave ex-inmates deep in debt

#273

Post by kaishiro »

1123581321 wrote: post #253
shakezula wrote: post #92

Years ago, I got a speeding ticket. I worked nights at the time, and the office to make the payment at had very strange hours because it was from a tiny town. My schedule made it difficult to make it over to the office during open hours, and one of the times I tried it was closed randomly over lunch because again, small town. (I learned later there was only one person who ran the whole office.) A day after my speedin…

That is frustrating, but when were you planning to pay? Couldn’t you have mailed it in? Suspended license driving is anti-social. Any law with a firm cutoff or deadline, and no gradual increase of penalty, sucks for those who barely miss complying with it. There needs to be some kind of consequence, though.

I'd argue that the humiliation of arresting and imprisoning someone for a single speeding ticket is the only anti-social occurrence here.

Re: At $249 per day, prison stays leave ex-inmates deep in debt

#274

Post by gs17 »

Jcowell wrote: post #236
2OEH8eoCRo0 wrote: post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

The office seem to cater to services where only the able and 9-5 crowd can easily access it. It seems more of a failing of this office to not provide an online alternative means to pay.

> where only the able and 9-5 crowd can easily access it

I'm not sure it's conveinient for that crowd either. It's always puzzled me how you were expected to make it to government offices open roughly 9-5 while most people work those same hours.

Re: At $249 per day, prison stays leave ex-inmates deep in debt

#275

Post by xg15 »

DiggyJohnson wrote: post #247
dekervin wrote: post #232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At what point do we start calling it a concentration camp system ? 60%? 80%?

It depends on answers to questions like “are these groups actually committing a disproportionate amount of the crime?” And I wouldn’t rush to the notion that you need to be justified in using hyperbolic/metaphorical language before you can criticize the problem.

Why would black or indigenous people as a group commit more crimes?

Re: At $249 per day, prison stays leave ex-inmates deep in debt

#276

Post by _vdpp »

lostlogin wrote: post #225
Akronymus wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

Can you explain what you mean? I’m can’t see what you are referring to at all and must be missing something huge.

George Floyd’s toxicology report taken after his death indicated fentanyl (and methamphetamine, and THC).

https://famous-trials.com/george-floyd/2648-george-floyd-the...

Re: At $249 per day, prison stays leave ex-inmates deep in debt

#278

Post by vinibrito »

germinalphrase wrote: post #210
pleb_nz wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your bank app doesn't have shortcuts to pay fines and taxes?

Is that a thing… anywhere?

Yes, in Brazil as well, for a long time now. Since bank apps started to exist actually.

Re: At $249 per day, prison stays leave ex-inmates deep in debt

#279

Post by GuB-42 »

mikebos wrote: post #70
wizofaus wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not clear how that's relevant to the comment you were replying to, unless you're suggesting that being jailed for minor controlled substance offenses is far more common in the US than the many other developed countries with similar laws?

My guess would be that most developed countries see prison not as a revenge but as the start to learn to function in society. America's system is more or less all about revenge.

Prisons serve more than on purpose: reinsertion and punishment are two of them, but another one I think is the most important is that it limits the ability for dangerous individuals to do harm. I would rather have murderers and rapists behind bars than next door.

If you accept the idea of the "war on drugs", it also goes for drug offenses: by putting drug dealers behind bars, you prevent people from buying drugs and harming themselves.

Re: At $249 per day, prison stays leave ex-inmates deep in debt

#280

Post by blooalien »

api wrote: post #19
breitling wrote: post #6

>All but two states have so-called “pay-to-stay” laws that make prisoners pay for their time behind bars What? Had no idea about this whatsoever and I consider myself a well-read person. Damn.

I too knew nothing about this and honestly find that frightening. How many other grotesquely perverse laws are on the books? Someone needs to create a hall of shame for these laws index by federal and for every state. This is perverse on so many levels. It’s not only ongoing punishment but it disincentivizes people from getting their lives in order and probably increases recidivism rates quite a bit. So in the end I…

> … "and probably increases recidivism rates quite a bit."

I'm fairly sure that's intentional, as prisons are "big business" in the USA (which also probably explains the ridiculously high rate of imprisonment here).

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