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Day ahead electricity prices for EU

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Re: Day ahead electricity prices for EU

#371

Post by PheonixPharts »

unyttigfjelltol wrote: post #80
pveierland wrote: post #50

Current spot price in northern Norway is €10.16/MWh, while it is €745.08/MWh in southern Norway (73x the price), largely due to limitations in transport networks between the electricity zones. The price in the northern zone is so low that some hydro plants have stopped producing electricity as they would be losing money at the current price level. https://www.skandiaenergi.no/dagens-spotpriser/ Electricity Maps has a…

All energy problem reduce to problems of energy transportation. We have a huge fusion reactor in the sky. The challenge is capture and transit. The problem is not incidental; it's fundamental.

This is why the real magic of fossil fuels isn't the energy they contain, but their energy density.

An efficient, large scale global economy is only possible with incredibly high energy density (and easy to transport and convert into usage energy) energy sources.

And, to your point, even global food supply is ultimately an issue of transporting energy from the sun to human bodies largely in the form of plant based carbohydrates. Human's ability to expand around the globe is predicated on the ability to transport the caloric requirements efficiently.

Re: Day ahead electricity prices for EU

#372

Post by throwaway2037 »

ClumsyPilot wrote: post #241
makomk wrote: post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Meanwhile over here in the UK, the press is blaming the energy crisis partly on the fact that our government didn't spend loads of money on solar and onshore wind like Germany. We're even worse situated to benefit from solar than they are. (The renewable program here is mostly focused on offshore wind, which is the least-bad option given our geography, plus attempts at nuclear that are widely criticized by the press…

Britain is the best position country in Europe for wind and tidal power. There was a project to pay down cable to import reliable, cheap 24/7 power from Iceland and hobernment said 'nah'. They also cancelled a 340 MW tidal project

Real question: What is the largest tidal power installation in the world? Why do we see so little of it?

Re: Day ahead electricity prices for EU

#373

Post by PheonixPharts »

google234123 wrote: post #115
unyttigfjelltol wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All energy problem reduce to problems of energy transportation. We have a huge fusion reactor in the sky. The challenge is capture and transit. The problem is not incidental; it's fundamental.

A huge fusion reactor in the sky that isn't available in the evening or when it's cloudy.

All energy on earth, baring geothermal, is ultimately solar energy. Fossil fuels are just one, very efficient, form of storing that energy.

Re: Day ahead electricity prices for EU

#374

Post by gniv »

AshamedCaptain wrote: post #226
rcMgD2BwE72F wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What your funny name for France, where we pay as much (if not more) than Germany for our electricity since the start of the year? More than half the country's nuclear power capacity has been shut down, mostly due to safety concerns https://nuclear-monitor.fr/#/mix .

Who is paying more for electricity in France? To my knowledge, the majority of French residential subscribe to the state-fixed "Tarif bleu", which hasn't increased price at all since February, and is still well below the German average. It is, in fact, for added ridiculousness, well below the retail prices of most of the countries we import energy from.

> Who is paying more for electricity in France?

EDF is. Which will end up as deficits in France's budget.

Re: Day ahead electricity prices for EU

#375

Post by boshomi »

andrepd wrote: post #163
kwhitefoot wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The sun is always shining somewhere. We need more interconnects.

Global power transfers don't work due to losses. The physics doesn't work out.

HVDC enables long-distance transmission with low losses:

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/331959599_A_compreh...

https://markets.businessinsider.com/news/stocks/building-a-2... (2 billion seems too cheep)

Re: Day ahead electricity prices for EU

#376

Post by Scoundreller »

ZeroGravitas wrote: post #366
pclmulqdq wrote: post #270

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because some places have excess amounts of hydropower and other places have huge energy shortfalls. Not everyone is using solar/wind power. It is a pretty straightforward arbitrage. I have no idea if it's worth doing, though.

Some Battery train companies include this in their plans. Even non Battery electric trains can speed up or slow down at different points (while still staying on schedule) to act as a variable demand for the local grids. Batteries just extend that. https://arstechnica.netblogpro.com/science/2021/11/can-we-ru... > The analysis becomes very interesting when the researchers leave freight behind and start thinking about w…

> Even non Battery electric trains can speed up or slow down at different points

I want this for everything with a battery, it’s own internal thermal mass or things I don’t need to complete as quickly as possible.

E.g.: laptop, washing machine (clothes or dishes), dryer, refrigerator, hot water heater, hvac, etc.

It just seems so underdeveloped on the consumer side.

Re: Day ahead electricity prices for EU

#377

Post by boulos »

inglor_cz wrote: post #367
jotm wrote: post #315

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As long as people won't even try to install a solar concentrator while bitching about rising prices, I won't take any of them seriously. Such a simple design, can be used for at least heating water for 3-6 months. But nah. Same for which the roofs. You don't have a white/silver roof on your house? Fuck you. On that note, you like cruise ships? Also fuck you.

"You don't have a white/silver roof on your house? Fuck you." I am one of your fuckees. The house I bought was expensive enough as it was. I am not changing a brand new dark roof for a different one for an exorbitant price right now, because budget. A perfectly new roof going down (isn't that actually waste?) for saving, say, 10 of 30 days when the AC is really needed? (I am also not even sure if roof colors are regu…

You don't have to replace the roof. You can coat it in a white, "elastomeric" paint like [1]. Each bucket can do about 450 sq ft (40 sq m) and is ~$100 for the supplies.

In California, roof color isn't regulated, but reflectivity (or rather energy absorption) is by Title 24. You're basically required on new construction to have a fairly efficient roof.

[1] https://www.homedepot.com/p/Henry-4-75-Gal-Acrylic-Reflectiv...

Re: Day ahead electricity prices for EU

#378

Post by liversage »

scottmcdot wrote: post #46

From the perspective of a retail electricity customer, would knowing this help reduce your bill?

In Denmark electric power consumption of homes have decreased by 10% in 2022. Apps that provide the variable hourly rate today and tomorrow are increasingly popular, and they are used to plan the best time to perform tasks that require electricity.

https://www.dr.dk/nyheder/penge/danskernes-stroemforbrug-er-...

Re: Day ahead electricity prices for EU

#379

Post by ZeroGravitas »

foxhill wrote: post #319
zionic wrote: post #314

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That gasoline wouldn’t be an energy source, it’d be an extremely crappy battery. Far better to just send the power via grid to an EV @95% then toss 60% or more of it to make a gallon of gas

it’s a more practical solution for right now though. we can’t expect the world to switch its entire infrastructure overnight, or even quickly. yes, the rich nations might get a head start, but they represent such a small fraction of emissions.

Its not practical. The extra energy costs act like a high tax.

It might make sense, for a while with aircraft, or for a classic car that rarely gets used, but would be too expensive for developing nations to use when they have other options. They'd save lots of money by using the same energy directly in newly built (or converted) EVs.

Re: Day ahead electricity prices for EU

#380

Post by adventured »

calaphos wrote: post #204
bjourne wrote: post #60

Remember that, while prices have soared, electricity generation has not become more expensive. The "electricity crisis" is a crisis for European consumers but a massive windfall for producers. This is a market failure - not an electricity failure.

Capacity has decreased - mainly due to a lot of french nuclear reactors offline for scheduled and (correlated) unscheduled maintenance. France went from Europe's largest exporter to largest importer of power this year. Add to that a dry summer woth historically low water levels in rivers, disrupting cooling as well as things like coal transport for power plants. And natural gas, which usually covers the more elastic…

Not to mention Germany (largest economy in Europe) and their nuclear debacle. They could have spent the last 20 years building additional nuclear power and reducing dependency on Russia, instead of doing the opposite. 15+ years ago it was obvious what Putin was and the direction Russia was heading.

Germany should be a super exporter of energy to the EU/Eurozone (they are a big electricity exporter, they should and could be considerably more so). They land border nine other nations (and are of course very close to Italy). They have the technical and financial ability to do it.

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