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Should You Buy an EV? A calculator to figure it out

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Re: Should You Buy an EV? A calculator to figure it out

#31

Post by lotsofpulp »

Faaak wrote: post #2

This doesn't take into account maintenance, which makes a huge difference ! My EV car (hyundai ioniq 2016) has now 100'000 km (62'000 mi) and I never once went to the garage for a service (except for tyres of course). Brake pads are still new, no oil change needed, etc.. Can't imagine how much it would've cost on a gas car

At 62k miles and 6 years, that would have probably been 6 to 10 oil and air filter changes, at $50 each would be $500. Brake pads would be $500.

Miscellaneous other might be $500. Easily less than $1,500 for most decent brand cars. Excluding the common cost of tires, of course.

How much extra did the Ioniq cost in 2016 over a Sonata or Acccord or Corolla or whatever the equivalent gas car would have been?

Re: Should You Buy an EV? A calculator to figure it out

#32

Post by kbos87 »

Yizahi wrote: post #3

Should you buy an EV? 1. You live in a private house where you can charge the car? - Yes 2. You don't have a charger at home? - No Simple, really :) . I always wanted to buy an EV but that's a deal breaker criteria. Also the secondary problem - author makes assumption about electricity price, but it almost doesn't matter at all if you are changing at the commercial stations only. They will charge you for as much as t…

Not to pile on but I’ll second some of the other commenters who have said that not being able to charge at home isn’t that big of a deal.

I live in a condo in a major US city and don’t have the option to charge at home.

From a convenience perspective, it’s truly turned out to be a non-issue. We’re at the point where I live that there are enough chargers around that I simply plug in once or twice a week while I’m running some errands.

From a cost perspective, it probably would be cheaper for me to charge at home, but it would be small and would take years to pay off the cost difference of having a charger installed. I spend so little on charging that I don’t really pay attention to it as an expense.

Obviously your situation may vary but I had a lot of anxiety about this and it turned out to be completely unfounded. Figure out where there are (ideally level 2 chargers) near you and you’ll be fine.

Re: Should You Buy an EV? A calculator to figure it out

#33

Post by ianai »

Yizahi wrote: post #17
wffurr wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I see a good variety of EVs parked on the street here in Cambridge, MA, USA. There’s a decent local network of level 2 and 3 chargers that are regularly used to charge the cars, in the neighborhood and at various area workplaces. Some are owned by the city and only charge enough to break even on installation and electricity cost. Workplace ones are often subsidized by the employers as a side benefit. Clearly it doesn…

I'm currently in the eastern EU, and while there a lot of EVs on the roads, the infrastructure is not usable for my personal use there too. No chargers at homes or near homes, not even in the new apartment blocks. No chargers at work parkings. Honestly, I wonder how can EU ban selling ICE cars even in 10 years, if the infrastructure in so much lagging behind.

It doesn’t take that long to wire up new electrical stuff. Just the will to do it. We’re talking 3.3kw to 6.6kw a drop unless it’s a fast charger. (Edit-the wider spread the slower chargers probably the lesser need for fast chargers, too.) 3.3kw is about 120v/27.5A. Not negligible but no one worries about hooking up hair driers to the grid and they draw tons of power. Reference the places putting chargers on light posts and similar.

Re: Should You Buy an EV? A calculator to figure it out

#34

Post by nulbyte »

cronokirby wrote: post #21
acallaghan wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I hear this view a lot - my main rebuttal is 'but can't top up your car with petrol/gas/diesel at home either'. The infra around EV charging needs to be much much better, I totally agree with this, but the idea that everyone will be able to charge their cars at home just isn't going to happen

One big difference is the density of the fuel. You can fill a car with gas in under a minute. While fast-charging (like Tesla's super charging) has growing deployment, that's still at least 15 minutes or so, which is a significant difference. And, the density of that is just not there yet, so for the near future having charging at home makes daily driving much more convenient.

The difference is: You're not standing around waiting for my car to charge. Your parked to do something else.

Depending on where there is, there may well be enough density. Here, we have 129 stations, and half of them are free. It goes up to over 300 if you include the rest of the metro. We're not that large a city, either.

Re: Should You Buy an EV? A calculator to figure it out

#35

Post by lotsofpulp »

serpix wrote: post #18
neilalexander wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I imagine the wear on the pads is reduced by the regenerative braking from the motors.

Eliminated almost entirely, they should revert to drums on EVs as discs get rust on them.

Why are discs more susceptible to rust than drums?

Re: Should You Buy an EV? A calculator to figure it out

#36

Post by sdflhasjd »

acallaghan wrote: post #16
Yizahi wrote: post #3

Should you buy an EV? 1. You live in a private house where you can charge the car? - Yes 2. You don't have a charger at home? - No Simple, really :) . I always wanted to buy an EV but that's a deal breaker criteria. Also the secondary problem - author makes assumption about electricity price, but it almost doesn't matter at all if you are changing at the commercial stations only. They will charge you for as much as t…

I hear this view a lot - my main rebuttal is 'but can't top up your car with petrol/gas/diesel at home either'. The infra around EV charging needs to be much much better, I totally agree with this, but the idea that everyone will be able to charge their cars at home just isn't going to happen

I agree, but right now in the UK, aside from the odd token charging point in a supermarket car park, realiably accessible charging stations are few and far between, particulary outside major city centres.

Re: Should You Buy an EV? A calculator to figure it out

#37

Post by sokoloff »

ianai wrote: post #33
Yizahi wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm currently in the eastern EU, and while there a lot of EVs on the roads, the infrastructure is not usable for my personal use there too. No chargers at homes or near homes, not even in the new apartment blocks. No chargers at work parkings. Honestly, I wonder how can EU ban selling ICE cars even in 10 years, if the infrastructure in so much lagging behind.

It doesn’t take that long to wire up new electrical stuff. Just the will to do it. We’re talking 3.3kw to 6.6kw a drop unless it’s a fast charger. (Edit-the wider spread the slower chargers probably the lesser need for fast chargers, too.) 3.3kw is about 120v/27.5A. Not negligible but no one worries about hooking up hair driers to the grid and they draw tons of power. Reference the places putting chargers on light po…

When's the last time someone and 10 of their neighbors dried their hair for 12 straight hours, though? It's not the instantaneous power draw from a single plug that people are worried about but rather the aggregate draw.

Re: Should You Buy an EV? A calculator to figure it out

#39

Post by Yizahi »

nulbyte wrote: post #34
cronokirby wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One big difference is the density of the fuel. You can fill a car with gas in under a minute. While fast-charging (like Tesla's super charging) has growing deployment, that's still at least 15 minutes or so, which is a significant difference. And, the density of that is just not there yet, so for the near future having charging at home makes daily driving much more convenient.

The difference is: You're not standing around waiting for my car to charge. Your parked to do something else. Depending on where there is, there may well be enough density. Here, we have 129 stations, and half of them are free. It goes up to over 300 if you include the rest of the metro. We're not that large a city, either.

I just looked at the plugshare map of the city I'm at currently. It show 101 stations up to 60 minutes pure drive distance. Also that's all kinds of chargers, private hotel spots, small two post stations, big stations.

Lets charitably assume that ALL of them are inside the city and that ALL of them are fast 10 post stations. So that's a capacity for about a thousand EV cars. That's in 1 million population city. I guess that's not enough at all.

PS: and what do you do for several hours while your car charges at the station? Walk in circles around the small overprices station shop? Drink coffee?

Re: Should You Buy an EV? A calculator to figure it out

#40

Post by sokoloff »

lotsofpulp wrote: post #35
serpix wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eliminated almost entirely, they should revert to drums on EVs as discs get rust on them.

Why are discs more susceptible to rust than drums?

The braking surface is on the outside, more exposed to water splash. Drums are not "sealed", but are much more closed off.
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