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What are Magnus Carlsen's chances of reaching 2900?

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Re: What are Magnus Carlsen's chances of reaching 2900?

#21
post #15

I think the 5% odds are an underestimation, because Carlsen will change his focus now and won't spend time preparing for the World Championship. He will likely also prioritize risky wins vs safer draws.

> He will likely also prioritize risky wins vs safer draws.

It seems kind of unfair that this is the strategy needed to increase ELO. If the safest strategy to guarantee a win in a tournament is winning a single game and drawing the rest, then you shouldn't be penalized for that in your ELO, versus playing risky and winning more but also losing some.

Re: What are Magnus Carlsen's chances of reaching 2900?

#22
post #7

I still can't understand how chess ratings work --even after 'RTFM' and having people try and explain it to me. Far far below the lofty heights of Carlsen &co., I play a fair bit on Lichess. Sometimes I'll play someone with a similar ranking to myself and beat them and will earn 3 or 4 points. Then we'll have a re-match which I lose and they'll gain 12 or 15 points. I just can't fathom how them beating me earns them…

About the manner of victory, I make an example from the game of go, which being points based makes this case more straightforward to evaluate. In go it's either win or loss, there is no draw. You can win by one point or by one hundred and you still score only one point in the tournament table. Why is that?

Because if you count to be losing by five points you could either resign (I'm assuming a game between strong players) or start playing more adventurous moves to turn the game around. Adventurous moves usually make for a larger win, let's say fifty points. Should players be punished for that and only play games that minimize the difference between the scores of the players? How boring. I guess this applies also to chess. Sacrifice, sacrifice, win. Or sacrifice, sacrifice, mistake, loss. I won't punish a mistake so much more than any other one.

Re: What are Magnus Carlsen's chances of reaching 2900?

#23

How much would get gain for a win vs a say 1800 rated player? Could he game the system by doing 1000 rated matches against poor players until he hits 2900?

No, because he wouldn't get any points for beating opponents that much lower than him. There is no such thing as a fractional rating point, so if the points gain gets below 0.5 it just rounds down to zero.

Re: What are Magnus Carlsen's chances of reaching 2900?

#24

How much would get gain for a win vs a say 1800 rated player? Could he game the system by doing 1000 rated matches against poor players until he hits 2900?

Only if he never actually loses one. Which he really shouldn't, but at high numbers the probability of slipping up becomes non-negligible.

Re: What are Magnus Carlsen's chances of reaching 2900?

#26
I think one major piece is consistently missed in those articles. Yes, the chances of him hitting 2900 do not depend only on his performance against other players, but from their elo as well. If the following 25 players in the world where all 2800+ Carlsen would already be 2900+.

Thus, Carlsen's best chances largely depend on elo inflation to widen the elo distribution itself.

One example of this: Louis de Bourdonnais which was #1 in the world in the 1800s skyrocketed his elo rating from 2600 to 2650 mostly as a result of the following 10 players moving their average elo from 2350 to 2450.

His winrate against them never changed. And what is required for 2350 players to go higher? That the players below they skill also raise their elos giving the top 10 more points when beating them. The more players will be fide rated the more Carslen's chances will increase but without a sufficient supply of 2700s, those at 2750 won't raise in elo, etc, etc

Re: What are Magnus Carlsen's chances of reaching 2900?

#27
post #7

I still can't understand how chess ratings work --even after 'RTFM' and having people try and explain it to me. Far far below the lofty heights of Carlsen &co., I play a fair bit on Lichess. Sometimes I'll play someone with a similar ranking to myself and beat them and will earn 3 or 4 points. Then we'll have a re-match which I lose and they'll gain 12 or 15 points. I just can't fathom how them beating me earns them…

Elo also depends on how many games you have played in a time format.

It is likely that the person with 12/15 point gains has less games, thus his delta variation is higher than yours. It takes tens of games before you take "normal" points.

Re: What are Magnus Carlsen's chances of reaching 2900?

#28

How much would get gain for a win vs a say 1800 rated player? Could he game the system by doing 1000 rated matches against poor players until he hits 2900?

Technically he could, I believe FIDE has a minimum rating increase of 1 point for the winner of a game with > 400 ELO advantage on their opponent. But if he broke 2900 by playing in minor tournaments against low rated amateur opponents no one would take it seriously that he broke 2900. Realistically many, maybe even all of the top players could push for record ELOs by only playing against players well below their level. But not only are the optics bad and the records would be looked at as illegitimate, it would take a lot of time playing long classical chess games against inferior opponents. Which is a major opportunity cost since their time would normally be spent playing in and studying for professional tournaments.

Re: What are Magnus Carlsen's chances of reaching 2900?

#30

I think one major piece is consistently missed in those articles. Yes, the chances of him hitting 2900 do not depend only on his performance against other players, but from their elo as well. If the following 25 players in the world where all 2800+ Carlsen would already be 2900+. Thus, Carlsen's best chances largely depend on elo inflation to widen the elo distribution itself. One example of this: Louis de Bourdonnai…

I would also argue that there is a source of ELO deflation going on. As the top level players all get better, theory evolves, people generally play better chess.

A player with a rating of 2750 today might have beat Kasparov in his prime, simply because chess has evolved.

In a way, it's similar to sports. Plenty of people today might have beat Carl Lewis at 100m 30 years ago, but they would probably not be considered greater athletes.

So in order to beat 2900, it would help if several other players got rankings of 2800-2850, but only if they did so without actually playing much better chess.

Or he could just have a temporary lucky/confident streak, and gain 40 rating points in a few tournaments.

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