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“We kill people based on metadata” and other metadata things

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Re: “We kill people based on metadata” and other metadata things

#141

Post by bombcar »

ta8645 wrote: post #79
pclmulqdq wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In 2010, an American citizen was killed in a drone strike by the US military, without a trial or any attempt to make an arrest. This was the first time in history that a US civilian was killed by the US military. Before 2010, we were doing just fine without executing citizens on suspect legal grounds. Edit: Edited to state that this was not fire of combatants in a combat zone.

> This was the first time in history that a US citizen was killed by the US military. That seems incredibly unlikely. Friendly fire incidents have been a fact of war, pretty much forever.

I find it incredibly hard to believe that no US non-military citizen was killed by either side in the Civil war.

Re: “We kill people based on metadata” and other metadata things

#143

Post by salawat »

bombcar wrote: post #138
devteambravo wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Incredibly chilling for you to have to type this! But yes indeed.

Ad serving probably has less false-positives, because those cost the ad companies money.

You think that false positives requiring the staging/deployment of a multi-million dollar weapon system don't cost money?

Re: “We kill people based on metadata” and other metadata things

#144

Post by throwaway_4ever »

forgetfulness wrote: post #29

For a while I saw Palantir showing what sounded like remorse in their website, in stating explicitly that they had purposefully taken distance from their days security contractors providing products in service of the War on Terrorism; they provided one that was used precisely for this. It was a change from the previous branding I saw from them, one where they would whitewash themselves by showcasing their most charis…

Palantir CEO on that: https://youtu.be/MeL4BWVk5-k?t=185

Re: “We kill people based on metadata” and other metadata things

#145

Post by ALittleLight »

westmeal wrote: post #72
pclmulqdq wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In 2010, an American citizen was killed in a drone strike by the US military, without a trial or any attempt to make an arrest. This was the first time in history that a US civilian was killed by the US military. Before 2010, we were doing just fine without executing citizens on suspect legal grounds. Edit: Edited to state that this was not fire of combatants in a combat zone.

Which citizen was it? I've never heard about this before but I wouldn't put it past those war mongering fucks.

They also killed his 16 year old son and 8 year old daughter in separate attacks. Both of whom were American citizens. (Daughter was Trump)

The basics are that Al-Awlaki was (allegedly) a kind of pro-terrorist or pro extreme Muslim kind of preacher moving about the Middle East spreading his message. Possibly also hooked up with real terrorists / jihadis. A drone strike killed Awlaki and a second drone strike, a couple weeks later, killed his sixteen year old son. The US claimed killing his son was an accident - but that's pretty implausible. Years later, under Trump, a special forces team killed his eight year old daughter.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anwar_al-Awlaki

Re: “We kill people based on metadata” and other metadata things

#146

Post by devNoise »

ivalm wrote: post #140
darawk wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pretty similar to the appeals process for being killed by the terrorist that the CIA chose not to assassinate.

How many Americans died from terrorism? How many foreigners died from anti-terrorism drone strikes?

The other question is how many terrorist did we create from drone strikes?

Re: “We kill people based on metadata” and other metadata things

#147

Post by guhidalg »

pclmulqdq wrote: post #93
tomjakubowski wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This was the first time in history that a US citizen was killed by the US military Not close to the first time. Kent State is one famous example. Countless people shot for trespassing on bases

The Ohio National Guard is not a branch of the US military. It reports to the government of Ohio.

Now you’re splitting hairs. A government ordered death is the same no matter if the shooter is a soldier or a national guardsman.

Re: “We kill people based on metadata” and other metadata things

#148

Post by ALittleLight »

engineer_22 wrote: post #106
A4ET8a8uTh0 wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is likely the most upsetting part. As flawed as US judicial system is, it is a system that still has to move within certain known parameters. The fact that judicial system stops applying the moment 'the government' decides it doesn't apply is in itself a big problem that effectively undermines basic trust in the system. I don't want to say that it started with Bush, because each president had their sins, but war…

-> some basic rules have to be followed if only to ensure citizenry that they are followed. I guess one of those rules could be: Don't travel overseas to participate in a war against the US government. Yes, I understand, this is a hard rule to follow, especially if you're of the rebellious bent, but comfort requires compromise.

Also it's a hard rule to follow if you are a child.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_Nawar_al-Awlaki

Re: “We kill people based on metadata” and other metadata things

#149

Post by Banana699 »

salawat wrote: post #143
bombcar wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ad serving probably has less false-positives, because those cost the ad companies money.

You think that false positives requiring the staging/deployment of a multi-million dollar weapon system don't cost money?

It's not about how much absolute money is spent per each false positive, it's about how much you can get away with wasting. If a decision maker in the CIA is not punished for each brain fart, why would they avoid mistakes ? You get the behaviour that you reinforce and tolerate.

Re: “We kill people based on metadata” and other metadata things

#150

Post by wombatpm »

forgetfulness wrote: post #120
nickff wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Uncertainty is (unfortunately) everywhere; for example, what probability is “beyond a reasonable doubt”? There are many who take issue with that question, but the answers I’ve seen range between 0.1% and 5%, with no general consensus.

What's the appeal process for being assassinated by the CIA like?

Similar to gmail and youtube suspension process. It happens to you, you or someone makes your case on social media, someone in google may listen and modify the policy rules.
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