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Is there hope for Linux on smartphones? [video]

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Re: Is there hope for Linux on smartphones? [video]

#31

Post by Teever »

nivenkos wrote: post #27
NuSkooler wrote: post #18

It's mentioned already, but: Android. Discounting Android as "Not Linux" enough is a mind boggle to me. Perhaps not "GNU" enough, but certainly the spirit of Linux -- customized for the particular needs, stable, fast, works on a plethora of hardware, etc.

When I think of a Linux phone, I really want something that supports a full GNU/Linux desktop as convergence. The Steam Deck does this perfectly!

Damn, you got me thinking now, that Valve of all people could probably put out a Linux phone.

The Steam Phone could be a game changer.

Re: Is there hope for Linux on smartphones? [video]

#32

Post by usrusr »

rvz wrote: post #7

> while we're picky about free software on our laptops, desktops and servers lots of us have a truck load full of proprietary software in their pocket every day. Does it have to be that way? It doesn't have to be like this, but it is also not 'early days' anymore and we have given this idea lots of time to gain any meaningful traction and it's very clear that there is almost no interest from the wider industry. Thus,…

But how many man-months of development on the GPL subset of the Android stack are funded by the mostly closed product, each day? From some angles, I'd say that it's not a failure at all (from others it certainly is), more like working as intended.

Re: Is there hope for Linux on smartphones? [video]

#33

Post by tingletech »

what-imright wrote: post #17
matrix12 wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think they conflate GNU with Linux kernel.

Why is the title “Is there hope for linux on smartphones?”? If it said “Is there hope for GNU on smartphones?” the answer would be a resounding no, because the community is fractured and politicized to the degree the products are uncompetitive. Pinephone is an example. Then there was the Ubuntu effort. Android, being partly closed as the GPL2 allows for, is proof that Linux can be highly successful without the GNU cr…

most of the user space tools originated from GNU (such as gcc), linux really just brought the kernel.

Re: Is there hope for Linux on smartphones? [video]

#34

Post by cma »

NuSkooler wrote: post #18

It's mentioned already, but: Android. Discounting Android as "Not Linux" enough is a mind boggle to me. Perhaps not "GNU" enough, but certainly the spirit of Linux -- customized for the particular needs, stable, fast, works on a plethora of hardware, etc.

When mapping shared memory or checking for the right broadcast subnet requires calling into Java code... it isn't Linux on the user side so much anymore.

Re: Is there hope for Linux on smartphones? [video]

#35

Post by cma »

CharlesW wrote: post #30
lrvick wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Android is Linux but it has nowhere close to the fully open source freedom of a traditional Linux workstation. This is why I carry a tiny linux laptop.

Phones are not PCs/general-purpose computers. Do you want your TV to be a general purpose computer as well? (Having put my family through a Media Center PC and TV remotes with keyboards/trackpads for several years, I don't recommend it.)

I run termux on mine and wish termux wasn't so restricted by google/android.

Re: Is there hope for Linux on smartphones? [video]

#36

Post by zekica »

Havoc wrote: post #16

Inclined to say no - mainly because of the camera. The gap between ability to mechanically take a pic and what the flagships are doing with AI driven post processing seems not only big but growing. Short of die hard linux/FOSS fans noticably worse pics is going to be an absolute show stopper

Look at what Intel is doing with MIPI IPU6 webcams. The solution already exists.

Re: Is there hope for Linux on smartphones? [video]

#37

Post by blendergeek »

CharlesW wrote: post #26
water-your-self wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The android operating system is not open soruce.

https://source.android.com/docs/setup/start/licenses

That is the license for the Android Open Source Project. Unfortunately, Google has spent the last fifteen years moving many parts of the stack and almost (if not) all the core apps to Google Proprietary versions. Most apps in AOSP no longer receive updates at all.

The dream is here is not just that we would be running "an open source stack" but that the active development would be on the open source stack. Sure, there are new releases of AOSP. But take a look at the core apps: Contacts, Calendar, Camera, Email, Location services. These are all proprietary now.

Android is open source in the same sort of way that MacOS is open source. There are some open source bits in there.

Re: Is there hope for Linux on smartphones? [video]

#38

Post by neverrroot »

Guess it depends on what your standards are. You can have it everywhere from today to likely never. Want just basic stuff, no apps store, no good camera, no good runtime on battery? Today, go get one. Value security more than anything else? Available today. Want a high end smart phone with proper open source Linux/Software and apps store, great camera, fast and great battery runtime? Likely never. Linux won’t get the required investment, nor will the hardware manufacturers provide the required support (no incentives). Even the Linux Desktop experience can’t properly get there in 2022.

But a proper Linux phone, say something like a PinePhone is great as a second phone.

Re: Is there hope for Linux on smartphones? [video]

#39

Post by z3t4 »

Nokia had Linux on their smartphone until Microsoft bought them and stopped everything, they even shut down the app store. The OS was called MeeGo. Part of the Nokia team however started their own company called Jolla and still produce smartphones running Linux, they call their OS Sailfish. (ignoring the fact that Android also uses the Linux kernel).

The problem with alternative phone OS:es is that in the country I live you must have either an iPhone or and Android phone because the ID monopoly and Payment monopoly refuse to support other operating systems...

Re: Is there hope for Linux on smartphones? [video]

#40

Post by calvinmorrison »

kitsunesoba wrote: post #22
NuSkooler wrote: post #18

It's mentioned already, but: Android. Discounting Android as "Not Linux" enough is a mind boggle to me. Perhaps not "GNU" enough, but certainly the spirit of Linux -- customized for the particular needs, stable, fast, works on a plethora of hardware, etc.

Vanilla Android or AOSP might kinda have “Linux Spirit” but I’m not sure what gets shipped on most consumer devices does… lots of random things locked down (including boot loader, sometimes), crapware all over the place, drivers and kernel changes that aren’t upstreamed making it difficult to install anything but carrier/manufacturer-flavored Android, etc. I think most people rooting for “smartphone Linux” are lookin…

My pixel broke (was running CalyxOS, lineage before that), and I had to get a quick burner phone to make work calls. Got a $200 dollar used samsung. I didn't realize what utter trash nonsense is loaded onto normal phones. It's absolutely bonkers what Samsung did to destroy Android with no value add.
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