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VS Code – What's the deal with the telemetry?

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Re: VS Code – What's the deal with the telemetry?

#61
I am one of those who began coding in Notepad and then quickly moved on to Vim and then to Emacs.

When the whole world of internet services began consolidating around the web and then later when the whole web began consolidating around a few powerful walled gardens, I saw how these trends began chipping away at our anonymity, privacy, web performance and software performance. Computers are ubiquitous but privacy is under attack. Hardware is faster but software is slower. Internet pipes are faster but websites are sluggish.

In all this turbulence I thought at least my software development tools are not affected by these terrible user-hostile trends. Emacs has become faster with faster hardware. While Vim was always fast, I am sure the Vim folks too would agree that they can now run Vim with a lot of plugins thanks to faster hardware. These editors do not do hidden telemetry. They don't add user hostile features. The core editor experience remains more or less the same year after year.

Even after all the disruption (I mean literally, disruption, not in some positive metaphorical way) in the rest of tech world, I have found consolation in my modest code editor, Emacs for me, Vim for some, other editors for other people. My code editor has always served my best interests. It helps me write code and documentation without any distractions. But when I read articles like this about VSCode and its telemetry, it really makes me anxious. Perhaps Emacs or Vim will never be afflicted by issues like this. But still ... If developer tools meant for ordinary software developers like me are going to start sneaking on my data and begin bundling user-hostile features, what hope is there for all other kind of software tools!

Re: VS Code – What's the deal with the telemetry?

#62
post #6

Worth noting that extensions may separately send telemetry, that do not have to adhere to the main VSCode telemetry configuration settings.

What a gross oversight from their part. Not only they build a product that, as pointed by the post, sends a excessive amount of data, but also allows anyone to do the same. > Why have licenses like these if they are just concerned with product improvement? That nails it for me. I have no reason whatsoever to use vscode.

That's kinda the point! For ex, my wakatime extension sends metrics about vscode usage so the developer can see their code stats.

Re: VS Code – What's the deal with the telemetry?

#63

I honestly wouldn't mind the telemetry but seen as VSCode on Windows will always inevitably completely freeze the entire OS to the point of requiring a restart if you leave it open for long enough, it doesn't give me much faith anyone is looking at it that closely in terms of using it to fix fundamental issues.

I have never experienced this, on any OS.

It's just Windows and how long are your uptimes and do you leave it open all the time?

I know it's not just me because I did find the github issue and there was no fix so I just stopped using VSCode

Re: VS Code – What's the deal with the telemetry?

#64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As the post mentioned, even the VSCodium team cannot shutdown all telemetry. Seems some do not have switches?

Why not just remove it from the source code?

Given the frequency of updates, maintaining a privacy fork with anything but minor changes would be a Sisyphean task.

Re: VS Code – What's the deal with the telemetry?

#65
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are much better IDEs. Check out the Jetbrains products. If you want an editor on Mac there is also Nova: https://nova.app The Rust and web related extensions work pretty well. I've been using that for a while. There are a few more around.

I use IntelliJ for $dayjob, and while I love it, it too submits telemetry. I do not know how pervasive it is, but the controls for it are not obvious in the general config window.

The only way to really escape telemetry today is a local firewall that can block network access by application.

I would like to see some analysis of the telemetry Jetbrains sends and whether you can turn it off. It's a paid pro IDE so it wouldn't surprise me if you can really disable it because some commercial customers will not want telemetry. In high security environments it's often considered bad due to the possibility of accidentally exposing secret information.

Re: VS Code – What's the deal with the telemetry?

#66
post #16
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What better text editor?

There are much better IDEs. Check out the Jetbrains products. If you want an editor on Mac there is also Nova: https://nova.app The Rust and web related extensions work pretty well. I've been using that for a while. There are a few more around.

Yeah, I almost mentioned IntelliJ, as an IDE it's almost unmatched.

Re: VS Code – What's the deal with the telemetry?

#67
It's safe to assume Microsoft is GDPR compliant. There's no sense in risking the fines GDPR could potentially levy for the sake of ... what exactly? There's no upside even if this data was somehow de-anonymized. The sensible thing to do is to delete everything within 90 days. Even if the developers behind VS Code didn't agree with that, legal and privacy at MS would make sure they would.

All this talk about how this data can be used to target people seems far fetched. Microsoft doesn’t have a serious ads business. What they do have are various products and services to sell to developers - Github and Azure among them. That’s the whole point of VSCode - give it away for free so they can understand developer practices and also upsell paid products. And if anyone doesn’t like that, they can simply … not pay Microsoft any money.

Re: VS Code – What's the deal with the telemetry?

#68

Telemetry is godsend for developers, since it lets them track down actual product usage and issues. Telemetry is a privacy nightmare for users, since it sends data to the developers outside of an average user's control - data which is probably easily associated with an individual and kept for eons (disk space is cheap after all). I think telemetry collection is starting to become a professional ethics issue for devel…

> Telemetry is godsend for developers, since it lets them track down actual product usage

This is is actually a terrible trap, as product usage tells you next to nothing about which features are useful. I suspect it' a big part of why a lot of software has turned to shit last decade or so.

Look at it this way: Your average fire extinguisher sits mounted on a wall its entire life and is never actually used. You still rather have it and not need it than need it and not have it.

Re: VS Code – What's the deal with the telemetry?

#69

It's Microsoft. It's what they do. It's been 20+ years. I'm not even old. I just don't understand how people haven't figured this out yet.

Okay but companies don’t just add telemetry because it’s a fun and exciting engineering challenge. They do so for legitimate engineering and business reasons. These solutions have privacy nuance they are not black and white/evil v good

My concern is that anybody at a company can suggest a telemetry point and it's added with little or no oversight, and store it forever. It may not be a fun engineering challenge (though it could be, depending on the metric), but sifting through the results is a "fun data interpretation" event. Especially for marketing and sales groups.

The solutions should have a privacy nuance... but don't. For example from TFA, collecting git branch and repo names. That seems like a terrible idea, since it's not like Microsoft's devs will have access to reproduce issues from those repos. It's also a potential leak of sensitive corporate data.

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