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Workplace surveillance is coming for you

pluralistic.net

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Re: Workplace surveillance is coming for you

#171

Post by hedora »

donatj wrote: post #140

The authors own point seemingly being that this will negatively affect companies bottom lines in the long run in the name of chasing stats seems to undermine the point of this being "late stage capitalism". If this does actually negatively affect bottom lines, it's bad business, end of story. Capitalism seeks to optimize output and if this is truly failing to do so, it's not a capitalist pursuit.

The author is calling out a failure mode of capitalism. The people producing the tools are pursuing capitalism, and the people adopting them likely have financial motivations to do so (stock plans, conflict of interests, etc…)

Re: Workplace surveillance is coming for you

#172

Post by goatlover »

shakezula wrote: post #124
sudden_dystopia wrote: post #84

Quit reading at “large stage capitalism”. Such a bs term. This is not capitalism, this is techno corporate fascism. That is what is failing and causing misery. And the more we gaslight capitalism, the further down the totalitarian path we are going to go.

We arrived at this place on the line directly from capitalism though. This is a failure of capitalism at least, and a direct incentive of it at worst. You can’t just say it’s not capitalism when it’s the exact consequence of capitalism just because it resulted in something you don’t like. The “totalitarian path” is the one that capitalism laid bare before your feet.

When Orwell wrote 1984 with it's constant surveillance, he had "late-stage capitalism" in mind? Are you saying that totalitarian governments wouldn't have made use of technological innovation to spy on their citizens, including worker output?

Re: Workplace surveillance is coming for you

#173

Post by AndrewKemendo »

giantg2 wrote: post #89
lcnPylGDnU4H9OF wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What kind of employer nickle-and-dimes a worker’s bathroom breaks? I had a teacher in high school who would respond the same way (more or less) whenever someone would ask to use the restroom: > If you ever have a job that needs you to ask to use the restroom, find a better job.

There are some strict time-keeping requirements for bathroom use when it comes to certain contracts, like government ones. It wasn't too bad, but I forget the specifics. It was like it had to be less than 5 minutes, or you use your 15 minute breaks or lunch for anything longer.

I have written many government contracts and I can tell you that there are no federal timekeeping requirements that would mandate that level of granularity.

Whomever wrote that contract was a doofus.

Re: Workplace surveillance is coming for you

#174

Post by goatlover »

donatj wrote: post #131
shakezula wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We arrived at this place on the line directly from capitalism though. This is a failure of capitalism at least, and a direct incentive of it at worst. You can’t just say it’s not capitalism when it’s the exact consequence of capitalism just because it resulted in something you don’t like. The “totalitarian path” is the one that capitalism laid bare before your feet.

We arrived at this place on the line directly from the formation of the sun. You don't talk about "late stage solar energy". This isn't any more the suns fault than it it is capitalisms fault; it's just a popular scapegoat.

I blame late-stage evolution. Apes with big brains starting refining tools in just the past few million years, and look where that got us.

Re: Workplace surveillance is coming for you

#175

Post by hedora »

GekkePrutser wrote: post #38
bloak wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I normally hyphenate such expressions when they function as adjectives: "white-collar workers". Obviously I'm a bit "old-fashioned" in that respect. (I may also be old.)

And its opposite is blue-collar so nothing to do with racism. Unless smurfs feel discriminated against :)

It’s a reference to working class jobs that are predominantly held by inbred British royalty.

/s

Re: Workplace surveillance is coming for you

#176

Post by Silhouette »

fezfight wrote: post #114
giantg2 wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are some strict time-keeping requirements for bathroom use when it comes to certain contracts, like government ones. It wasn't too bad, but I forget the specifics. It was like it had to be less than 5 minutes, or you use your 15 minute breaks or lunch for anything longer.

I know some people with IBS for who that would amount to discrimination.

And likewise for many other medical conditions.

Or being female and unlucky with the effects of your cycle.

Or just having a rough day because something you ate was bad.

It's one thing if there's an ongoing pattern of long, unexplained breaks and someone's line manager has a discreet word about it and asks if there is anything they need to know. However routinely messing with things like breaks or availability of kitchen and bathroom facilities is surely one of the most counterproductive policies an employer could adopt. Nothing says we respect and value our people like treating them as subhuman!

Re: Workplace surveillance is coming for you

#177

Post by [deleted] »

ivraatiems wrote: post #104

I'm all for privacy and I cringe at the idea of workplace surveillance of the type described. That said, this article is loaded with false comparisons and poor analogies and just doesn't make its point very well. In general, it confuses "The Bad Government want to intentionally surveil you" with "idiot corporations chasing profits incidentally surveil you and think you're enough of an idiot to swallow it". > 20 years…

[deleted]

Re: Workplace surveillance is coming for you

#178

Post by EMM_386 »

rightbyte wrote: post #27

I like the term "bossware". I think I will use it the next time I wiggle the mouse to make my Teams status green again.

> I think I will use it the next time I wiggle the mouse to make my Teams status green again.

https://github.com/arkane-systems/mousejiggler

Re: Workplace surveillance is coming for you

#179

Post by UweSchmidt »

bheadmaster wrote: post #52

I'm currently reading "The Tyranny of Metrics" which provides a decent analysis of how over-measuring things that don't have anything to do with the real goal often serves as a deterrent to real progress. What managers want to know is how much do their workers contribute to the success of the company . What they measure is how much time do workers spend doing X . They're completely glossing over the middle step of ho…

Workplace surveillance is bad even if it "measures the right thing" and makes us all super-efficient, over-surveilled workers.

Re: Workplace surveillance is coming for you

#180

Post by oezi »

wussboy wrote: post #80
oezi wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In Germany the entire premise of monitoring performance is prohibited. Employers aren't even allowed to look at email.

Curious how this affects contact centres? They monitor everything agents do down to the millisecond. And "All calls are recorded for training and quality purposes."

But they can't use it to assess performance or associate it with individuals.
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