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Nobody wants to teach anymore

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Re: Nobody wants to teach anymore

#191

Post by bombcar »

diognesofsinope wrote: post #167
_vdpp wrote: post #98

A few random thoughts: 1. For as much as we spend on education, teachers seem to be grossly underpaid - to be getting robbed of their share of the budget. Where does that money go? 2. It seems that education degrees are seen as easier to achieve than others. 3. Teachers frequently complain about how they are unappreciated, yet children spend _12 years_ in their care. Why do people come up to them and say they hated s…

> 1. For as much as we spend on education, teachers seem to be grossly underpaid - to be getting robbed of their share of the budget. Where does that money go? Counterpoint: teachers' pay is great, it's just backloaded in pension plans. > 2. It seems that education degrees are seen as easier to achieve than others. Yeah, but cost is the same and cost is what's important. > 4. Many school problems are caused by disrup…

I suspect that almost all of the success of private schools can be ascribed to being able to kick students out and not requiring fifty billion dollars in degrees to teach.

Re: Nobody wants to teach anymore

#192

Post by danaris »

diognesofsinope wrote: post #167
_vdpp wrote: post #98

A few random thoughts: 1. For as much as we spend on education, teachers seem to be grossly underpaid - to be getting robbed of their share of the budget. Where does that money go? 2. It seems that education degrees are seen as easier to achieve than others. 3. Teachers frequently complain about how they are unappreciated, yet children spend _12 years_ in their care. Why do people come up to them and say they hated s…

> 1. For as much as we spend on education, teachers seem to be grossly underpaid - to be getting robbed of their share of the budget. Where does that money go? Counterpoint: teachers' pay is great, it's just backloaded in pension plans. > 2. It seems that education degrees are seen as easier to achieve than others. Yeah, but cost is the same and cost is what's important. > 4. Many school problems are caused by disrup…

> Counterpoint: teachers' pay is great, it's just backloaded in pension plans.

This is no longer true in most places, and was never a good enough reason to justify paying starting teachers poverty wages.

New York State, which I think most will agree is a state with a strong teachers' union and all that goes with it, has been phasing out defined-benefit pension plans over the past few decades. My mother-in-law, who retired about 10 years ago, was among the last wave to get the "Tier I" full-salary pensions; if you become a teacher in NYS now, you get a much less generous package (I don't know offhand whether it's still defined-benefit, just less, or if they've switched to defined-contribution plans now).

Re: Nobody wants to teach anymore

#193

Post by [deleted] »

SturgeonsLaw wrote: post #185

The United States seems hellbent on sabotaging education. This is not going to help future generations, and is going to put the likelihood of ongoing hegemony into question - over time, how can that compete with nations that continually invest in their population?

[deleted]

Re: Nobody wants to teach anymore

#194

Post by enragedcacti »

pnf wrote: post #130
anthonyskipper wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

Some of the worst educational outcomes in the US are in deep blue states and deep blue cities. Meanwhile, suburban communities in the US tend to vote more "red" and are also the places people go to raise families because of the better public schools.

in the USNews ranking, 8/10 of the best states Pre-K-12 are blue, while 10/10 worst are red.[1]

When you evaluate things beyond the partisan lens, poverty is a massive predictor in education outcomes which is why many deep blue cities do poorly and why many deep red states do poorly as well.

Separately, the suburbs in the US are about as purple as it gets. Suburbs also have the lowest rate of poverty compared to urban and rural. [2]

[1] https://www.usnews.com/news/best-states/rankings/education

[2] https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2018/10/02/5-facts-abo...

Re: Nobody wants to teach anymore

#195

Post by danaris »

bombcar wrote: post #191
diognesofsinope wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 1. For as much as we spend on education, teachers seem to be grossly underpaid - to be getting robbed of their share of the budget. Where does that money go? Counterpoint: teachers' pay is great, it's just backloaded in pension plans. > 2. It seems that education degrees are seen as easier to achieve than others. Yeah, but cost is the same and cost is what's important. > 4. Many school problems are caused by disrup…

I suspect that almost all of the success of private schools can be ascribed to being able to kick students out and not requiring fifty billion dollars in degrees to teach.

Almost all of the success of private schools is, in fact, the former. Being able to select who goes there basically lets them set their outcomes.

Re: Nobody wants to teach anymore

#198

Post by donatj »

SamuelAdams wrote: post #22

> Demoralization is what happens when you spend years becoming an expert in a subject area, and nobody cares. They’d rather hire another MBA to make all the important decisions, while they stick us on committees writing reports for ghosts. That’s when teachers start to withdraw from their jobs, when we realize it doesn’t matter what we think, and it definitely doesn’t matter how amazing we are at what we do. This was…

I think there's a point though where people are so deep in it, they can't see the forest through the trees anymore.

Security, as you mentioned, is definitely a balance with what your users will actually want to do. Security experts see doomsday scenarios everywhere, but if their solution is a hassle, your customers will just go to the less secure competitor.

I’ve worked with DBAs who were absolutely experts and knew far more than us but wanted to normalize the data to the point where actually retrieving it would have been a major hassle of JOINs. There’s a balance there that experts miss.

"Experts" in my general experience often lack the big picture. They get so honed in on their little area of expertise that they can forget that people don't value what they value to the same degree.

Re: Nobody wants to teach anymore

#199

Post by _vdpp »

dorchadas wrote: post #141
_vdpp wrote: post #98

A few random thoughts: 1. For as much as we spend on education, teachers seem to be grossly underpaid - to be getting robbed of their share of the budget. Where does that money go? 2. It seems that education degrees are seen as easier to achieve than others. 3. Teachers frequently complain about how they are unappreciated, yet children spend _12 years_ in their care. Why do people come up to them and say they hated s…

As a former teacher from the States (and maybe will go back to it one day, either internationally, or in another country permanently, depending on how life works out), I'd live to give my answers to some of this. Note, I'm biased. My undergraduate degree was not in teaching but in physics. I did a masters programme in teaching to transition to becoming a teacher. I enjoyed teaching, but just ended up finding it borin…

Why are differentiated classes such a taboo?

I feel like a more trades-oriented approach with kids who don’t have the desire, motivation or aptitude for college would lead to more engagement and give those kids a better chance at success.

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