Ask HN: I automated part of someone else's job in my free time

Re: Ask HN: I automated part of someone else's job in my free time – how to proceed?

#71

Post by paulcole » Sat, Aug 20, 2022, 7:41 PM UTC

fatherzine wrote: post #60

TaylorAlexander wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I genuinely believe we can make a world where no one is required to work for survival. We could intentionally automate as much as possible while also ensuring that automation is collectively owned. Then we could all collect dividends on our system with ample time off for "what we will" as the activists fighting for the 8 hour work day used to say. I believe strongly that the current economic system is effective prima…

"no one is required to work for survival" Sadly, this automates away the #1 source of meaning in one's life. "I made it this far, in spite of all the adversity" is what most decent adults lean into to motivate themselves out of their beds in the morning.

What do you mean by “decent”?

In the US at least, we’re going to get a point in the next few generations where it’s going to get harder and harder for many to find meaning in life. Increased automation, increased climate change, decreased financial security for people who expected to be secure.

It’s going to be rough.

Re: Ask HN: I automated part of someone else's job in my free time – how to proceed?

#72

Post by qaid » Sat, Aug 20, 2022, 7:42 PM UTC

I had a similar situation at my previous company. After rewriting a web app for another team, I started E2E testing and questioned the entire app’s existence and whether the business process could be automated.

After verifying in the server logs that the users never really validated data (always clicking “submit” after a second or two), I discussed this idea with our business analyst and got the go-ahead, and spent another couple of weeks to automate everything.

Long story short, it was a mess. There was actually one piece of the puzzle that they owned that I couldn’t automate away (essentially clicking a button). So when presenting it all to them (via email), the team lied and told us it “wasn’t working” and CC’d our managers and one level up the chain as well. This manual business process stayed with them. They kept the web app tho.

My advice is to make sure this kind of thing is known to management, and to make sure you can prove to them that this entire process can be automated without problems. Or let it go if you don’t think you can handle the backlash.

Re: Ask HN: I automated part of someone else's job in my free time – how to proceed?

#73

Post by fatherzine » Sat, Aug 20, 2022, 7:45 PM UTC

paulcole wrote: post #71

fatherzine wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"no one is required to work for survival" Sadly, this automates away the #1 source of meaning in one's life. "I made it this far, in spite of all the adversity" is what most decent adults lean into to motivate themselves out of their beds in the morning.

What do you mean by “decent”? In the US at least, we’re going to get a point in the next few generations where it’s going to get harder and harder for many to find meaning in life. Increased automation, increased climate change, decreased financial security for people who expected to be secure. It’s going to be rough.

This is a great insight. Once "work is no longer required for survival", people are going to soon discover that "work is not longer sufficient for survival" either.

"Decent" as in: we believe that character, including work ethic, can make or break a life.

Re: Ask HN: I automated part of someone else's job in my free time – how to proceed?

#74

Post by duxup » Sat, Aug 20, 2022, 7:45 PM UTC

jeroenhd wrote: post #65

Simon_O_Rourke wrote: post #51

Somewhat related to your predicament, a good friend of mine was working data entry in Verizon in the early 2010s, and automated his entire job with VBA. Never told anyone on his team, least of all his manager. Spent a year or so doing no more than 10 minutes work per day. Learned Python and after a year revealed all and left for a better job. Apparently there was chaos afterwards. So, either tell your direct manager…

I don't understand why you would reveal that you automated your job after all that time. If the contract states that you get paid in hours rather than tasks per time period, you might end up losing a lawsuit. Just leave and say nothing. Don't give your code to someone else, don't give it to the company, just go. Even without the potential lawsuit, on the odd chance that your future employer ever calls up your previou…

I’m inclined to agree. If I’m a data entry drone and the company can’t / doesn’t want to automate the job then they made their bed.

I also suspect the person who did this is doing a fair amount of spot checking to avoid being caught, more than the company might do.

Re: Ask HN: I automated part of someone else's job in my free time – how to proceed?

#75

Post by dgfitz » Sat, Aug 20, 2022, 7:45 PM UTC

dvfjsdhgfv wrote: post #48

dgfitz wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The cynic in ME says: establish an LLC, find a front man/woman to sell it back to your current company, and rake.

Ignoring whether it's a good idea, this is not trivial these days - both parties need to really trust each other given the number of ways things can go wrong.

Agreed, but you can say that about 2 cars passing each other at a 4-way stop.

Sometimes you just need to take a calculated risk and see where it goes.

Re: Ask HN: I automated part of someone else's job in my free time – how to proceed?

#76

Post by TaylorAlexander » Sat, Aug 20, 2022, 7:47 PM UTC

fatherzine wrote: post #70

TaylorAlexander wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Family? Friendship? Education, community, creative pursuit, experimentation, travel? I really don’t think that compulsory labor is the best way for people to find meaning. We’re not going to sit around on the couch forever feeling so miserable that we can’t go out and do anything. We’d be so free to explore what we want! Sure, people raised in a society that worships labor would feel unsure of their footing for a whi…

All these are important, /because/ life is survival. Remove the /because/, and the secondary characteristics will fade away. One can just do whatevs, it doesn't make a difference anyways.

Is that true? People wealthy enough to ensure their lifetime survival don’t seem miserable.

Re: Ask HN: I automated part of someone else's job in my free time – how to proceed?

#77

Post by TaylorAlexander » Sat, Aug 20, 2022, 7:49 PM UTC

vincnetas wrote: post #56

TaylorAlexander wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I genuinely believe we can make a world where no one is required to work for survival. We could intentionally automate as much as possible while also ensuring that automation is collectively owned. Then we could all collect dividends on our system with ample time off for "what we will" as the activists fighting for the 8 hour work day used to say. I believe strongly that the current economic system is effective prima…

Don't forget to automate defence (yah that one, military), and how to prevent any interested party in controlling that automated defence system.

I think Americans over estimate how much investment in defense is needed. Massive defense spending is needed when you’re abusing the rest of the world. Less so if you’re not.

Re: Ask HN: I automated part of someone else's job in my free time – how to proceed?

#78

Post by nerbert » Sat, Aug 20, 2022, 7:49 PM UTC

peterkelly wrote: post #68

Most of the IT industry is about automating tasks that would otherwise have to be done manually. Many of us here, myself included, are employed to do precisely this kind of thing on a full-time basis. If you've come up with a way to make your employer's business processes more efficient, that's a good thing. You should share your work with the relevant people, talk about it with your manager and the people who are do…

> If you've come up with a way to make your employer's business processes more efficient, that's a good thing.

Reading your comment, common sense woud agree with you. But it feels like you're reversing things. IF (and only if) OP's company promotes a healthy culture, that initiative IS actually positive (because OP doesn't have to worry too much about the outcome, they know they'll be rewarded and well received by other employees). If the culture is toxis / incompetent, there is very little benefit to that: OP would face the backlash of other employees, wouldn't be rewarded by their bosses, and other employees might face negative consequences for OP's initiatives.

There ARE definitely cases and culture where optimization isn't a desirable trait.

Re: Ask HN: I automated part of someone else's job in my free time – how to proceed?

#79

Post by fatherzine » Sat, Aug 20, 2022, 7:50 PM UTC

TaylorAlexander wrote: post #76

fatherzine wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All these are important, /because/ life is survival. Remove the /because/, and the secondary characteristics will fade away. One can just do whatevs, it doesn't make a difference anyways.

Is that true? People wealthy enough to ensure their lifetime survival don’t seem miserable.

Ha! If only rich heirs wasting their lives on drugs & hookers weren't such a pervasive stereotype.

Re: Ask HN: I automated part of someone else's job in my free time – how to proceed?

#80

Post by brippalcharrid » Sat, Aug 20, 2022, 7:50 PM UTC

Build a generalized SaaS product that doesn't rely on proprietary information, make it polished enough that there's a chance the organization will start using it, then arrange for decision-makers in your the org to find out about it without exposing yourself.

Otherwise your boss might get some minimal level of credit for this, but you're not going to get anything out of it, and there is every chance of it backfiring spectacularly for you if that would provide an easy way for the organization to more efficiently absorb 100% of your work product (or if it would limit embarrassment for well-connected managers).