Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Simple mix of soap and solvent could help destroy ‘forever chemicals’

science.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

171–180 of 239 posts

Re: Simple mix of soap and solvent could help destroy ‘forever chemicals’

#171

Post by blix »

kragen wrote: post #169
blix wrote: post #165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If asking for scientific research to support claims is witch-burning, truly science literacy is in a sad state. And I'm not sure I would really consider a "Go Ask Alice" column as peer-reviewed research.

But the claim in question is one of the best-known and most thoroughly established claims in all of toxicology. Asking for scientific research supporting the biocompatibility of PTFE is akin to asking for scientific research supporting biological evolution or the claim that people have landed on the moon: it's a sure sign that the person making the demand has a pre-existing flimsy pretext for rejecting literally all…

If it's truly such a well established claim it should be trivial to find and link a study actually demonstrating its safety when ingesting small amounts over a large period of time. No such study was linked. Probably because longitudinal studies are extremely rare.

It's not a rejection of all research to say that some questions remain unanswered. In fact, I'd say it is the foundation of good science to understand which claims are supported by evidence, and which claims are not.

Re: Simple mix of soap and solvent could help destroy ‘forever chemicals’

#172

Post by blix »

kragen wrote: post #170
blix wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What about larger sizes :) Physical effects can matter as much as chemical. Diatomacious earth has conflicting evidence anyway. Silica gel and glass aren't really the same thing. I did mean TiO2. There is a reason the EU considers it a carcinogen and is banning it from several classes of products.

Silica gel is glass with nanometer-sized pores in it. Bottle glass has additional additives that lower its melting point and increase its solubility (oxides of sodium and calcium). The EU has irrationally banned all sorts of things since the witch-burners have seized control of the government apparatus. Borate fire retardants and fertilizers is one of my favorite examples.

Make some car windows out of silica gel and let me know how it goes :) I think you will find nanometer-sized pores can actually matter a lot!

I'm not sure dismissing all research that disagrees with me as witch-burning would be a good habit as a scientist.

Re: Simple mix of soap and solvent could help destroy ‘forever chemicals’

#173

Post by Auracle »

doodlebugging wrote: post #160
sbierwagen wrote: post #4

The paper: https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/science.abm8868 The "soap and solvent" is sodium hydroxide (lye) and DMSO at 120 degC. Those are... fairly... well behaved chemicals, but lye is stout stuff and DMSO attacks nitrile gloves. You could imagine a remediation process that uses this process but the combo ain't exactly Dawn dish soap. I'd almost prefer pyroprocessing over it.

About 40 years ago I boarded my horse with an old cowboy who used DMSO as a horse liniment. He had been using it for years any time one of his mounts was worked pretty hard or when someone brought a lame horse to him. He would rub the joints, calves, and thighs of the horse down good with DMSO for a few days and then they were good to go again. He also used it on his wife. He told me that she had type I diabetes and…

DMSO also makes your breath smell like garlic after you’ve had it on your skin. I wouldn’t want to be around a horse that’s had a healthy dose, and I certainly wouldn’t love if my wife had to use it every day.

Re: Simple mix of soap and solvent could help destroy ‘forever chemicals’

#174

Post by doodlebugging »

Auracle wrote: post #173
doodlebugging wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

About 40 years ago I boarded my horse with an old cowboy who used DMSO as a horse liniment. He had been using it for years any time one of his mounts was worked pretty hard or when someone brought a lame horse to him. He would rub the joints, calves, and thighs of the horse down good with DMSO for a few days and then they were good to go again. He also used it on his wife. He told me that she had type I diabetes and…

DMSO also makes your breath smell like garlic after you’ve had it on your skin. I wouldn’t want to be around a horse that’s had a healthy dose, and I certainly wouldn’t love if my wife had to use it every day.

Yeah, so I've heard. Life is full of trade-offs and if I knew that it would help my wife I'd rub that shit all over her and buy lots of Peppo-mint Life Savers so she never had to do without.

Re: Simple mix of soap and solvent could help destroy ‘forever chemicals’

#176

Post by ricardobeat »

jerry1979 wrote: post #132
bfrog wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cast iron is low maintenance, just don't over think the seasoning thing and don't cook overly acidic things. Cook with oil, clean with soap and hot water (use a plastic scraper if you need to...), dry on the stove and once dry wipe with a paper towel you put a little drop of oil on. Wait until the oil just smokes and turn it off. Done. Takes 1min tops. You can use steel utensils, just don't go scratching at it when c…

I scrape the heck out of my cast iron pan using a bit of chain mail I keep by the sink in order to clean it. I do reapply oil and heat as you suggest. Do you reckon I'm missing out on some benefits of cast iron because I scrape it so relentlessly?

You’re probably stopping the seasoning from building up, and making it more sticky. Hot water and a soft nylon brush should be enough for 90% of your cooking, the occasional sticky burger just needs a 5m hot water bath to let go.

Re: Simple mix of soap and solvent could help destroy ‘forever chemicals’

#177

Post by ddingus »

rayiner wrote: post #166
kragen wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can definitely fry eggs on teflon without butter or oil or anything. I have this vague memory that I used to be able to do this on cast iron when I lived in the US, with maybe the occasional bit sticking.

But why.

Well, if one really wants to taste the subtle tastes of an egg, cooking sans oil does that.

By subtle, I mean similar to the difference between veggie oil and olive or canola oil. These all have a distinct taste to me, and I dislike canola enough to notice when it's been used.

The egg by itself has flavors that get dominated by the oil flavors.

To some people it matters. Simple as that.

Re: Simple mix of soap and solvent could help destroy ‘forever chemicals’

#178

Post by ddingus »

richiebful1 wrote: post #137
collegeburner wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

tbh i've never gone wrong with lodge and it's a much better budget option if u don't have the cash for that. used it for years and works great.

Get a lodge and scrub it with steel wool to clean. It'll be super smooth in a few months in my experience

That is what we did. The lodge pan is a good performer for the price.

Re: Simple mix of soap and solvent could help destroy ‘forever chemicals’

#180

Post by acrobatsunfish »

ars wrote: post #54
Dan_- wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bullshit. There is “toxic” and there is “causes cancer, even outside California, reduces fertility, and negatively affects fetal development.” Just because something doesn’t kill you immediately does not mean it isn’t harmful.

Teflon is not harmful. Period. It doesn't cause ANYTHING in the body. It's about the most inert material that you can possibly ingest.

It will kill birds in your house though, be warned!
Post reply on HN