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Edible insects role in transmission of parasitic diseases to humans (2019)

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Re: Edible insects role in transmission of parasitic diseases to humans (2019)

#441

Post by hombre_fatal »

wyre wrote: post #92
markdown wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Only little backyard operations use animal manure. No large food chain will carry greens grown in animal manure.

Maybe so, but how does that explain how E. coli outbreaks on lettuce? From what I understand the waste from animal farms run off into waterways that feed the vegetable farms.

Looking into this, it's hard to say since there are contamination issues at every point between preharvest and the moment you put it into your mouth: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6899298/

It doesn't seem to rank the causes it lists, but googling it suggests widespread contamination caused by fecal matter runoff from animal ag finding its way into irrigation water.

Re: Edible insects role in transmission of parasitic diseases to humans (2019)

#442

Post by eru »

shaburn wrote: post #409
eru wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> [...] the probability of catastrophic outcomes is exponential [...] What does that even mean? Do you want to say that the probability is high?

The new, certainly exponential variable, is the viral media growth in popularity of eating bugs. Viral(exponential) adoption of consuming bugs will increase the risk of (apparently already great) transmission of deadly diseases as an increasing rate. This very conversation stands as of evidence of exponential adoption of disease transmission from bug consumption due to online media growth on the subject.

Sorry, could you point me to any exponential increase in the popularity of eating insects?

I don't really see how this conversation is proving anything of the sort. (If it did, could we please talk about eating a healthy balanced diet, too? I'd like to see an exponential increase in adoption of that, just from talking about it.)

Re: Edible insects role in transmission of parasitic diseases to humans (2019)

#443

Post by eru »

shaburn wrote: post #396
eru wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

'Asien' didn't misuse any math terms. I don't know why they're being downvoted. 'Shaburn' made some claims that sounded like they want to be math, but didn't make any sense as math. Hence my confusion. I recognise that people use terms colloquially, like 'exponential', but given all the (pseudo?) sophisticated, math-y language in the comment > Given the rate of mutation and transmission in bugs with natural gestation…

1. Number of people eating bug(driven by mimesis pushed through a media narrative and thus typically viral(often exponential). 2. Number of variety of bugs being eaten(regionality and entrepreneurialism((often referred to as Cambrian explosions in perfectly competitive markets, thus exhibiting exponential growth functions)). 3. Number of geographies bugs for consumption being grown in. 4. Number of production methods…

Could you please point to any source for your claim that the number of people eating insects has grown dramatically?

I could find this study from 2015 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4552653/ which says:

> At least 2 billion people globally eat insects in over 113 entomophageous countries though this habit is regarded negatively or as revolting by others [4–6]. More than 1900 species are consumed by local populations globally but insect consumption (entomophagy) shows an unequal distribution.

There's roughly 8 billion people on the globe. Between 2 billion to 8 billion, there's not much room left for exponential growth.

Re: Edible insects role in transmission of parasitic diseases to humans (2019)

#444

Post by hombre_fatal »

the_only_law wrote: post #319
wyre wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Soy exists and is a complete protein.

Is it? Every time vegan/vegetarianism or carnivore diets come up, it’s always a massive debate on whether suplimental proteins are any good.

It is. But protein is also a weird battleground as it's in just about everything you eat.

Just as a plant-only eater would want to ensure they are getting certain nutrients like B12 and vitamin D, meat-only eaters have their own share of things to worry about: vitamin C, calcium, boron, potassium, magnesium, etc. Yet if you follow carnivore influencers, you'd think beef has the nutritional breakdown of a multivitamin.

The real take-away should be to track the nutrients in the things you eat and then see if there's something you can add to fill the gaps.

Re: Edible insects role in transmission of parasitic diseases to humans (2019)

#445

Post by chitowneats »

antirez wrote: post #431
zasdffaa wrote: post #419

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> making it too simple to parse comments and social network posts, creates users that struggle to read more complex content That's a very strange argument - would you apply it to coding too? Perhaps remove comments so people are forced to interpret the code alone.

In this case it's like if there were centuries of already written code with huge value, all written without comments. You don't want to limit the ability of programmers to read it. However things are very different in their dynamics: reading text without well separated paragraphs is mostly a matter of habit: a simple skill to achieve, so discouraging this ability has very little return. Lack of comments make reading…

Thank you for the paragraphs, sir.

I still don't agree with your point fundamentally, but I appreciate your work immensely, and that is far more important.

Re: Edible insects role in transmission of parasitic diseases to humans (2019)

#446

Post by sacrosancty »

easytiger wrote: post #198
sacrosancty wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is a lot of puritanicalishism in current western culture. I miss the 1990's when people were excited for the future and the upward course of human history.

How is eating bugs to satisfy the scalability and reporducibility goals of a software developer who spends hundreds of billions lobbying governments to change what i eat because it meets both his pseudo moral and investment portfolio agendas "the upward course of human history."?

I was referring to the general complaint of the parent poster about how people feel enjoying pleasures is wrong.

Re: Edible insects role in transmission of parasitic diseases to humans (2019)

#447

Post by steve_adams_86 »

throwaway09223 wrote: post #279
steve_adams_86 wrote: post #275

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That isn’t true, though. I might be more likely to get sick, but I’m less likely to die if I do.

It is true, and you are both more likely to get sick and more likely to die from fresh vegetables than from steak. The primary contaminant in steak is E. coli. You are more likely to consume E. coli from a salad than from a steak.

The data doesn't back this up in any country I can find.

A quick google search yields a few results, each pointing to the same conclusion:

https://www.cdc.gov/foodborneburden/attribution/attribution-...

> Meat and poultry, a combination of four animal food categories, Beef, Game, Pork, and Poultry, accounted for fewer illnesses, but for 29% of deaths.

Poultry accounted for the most deaths (19%); many of those were caused by Listeria and Salmonella infections. This rate is partly due to three large Listeria outbreaks linked to sliced processed deli turkey meat; the last such large outbreak occurred in 2002.

Produce, on the other hand, accounted for 27% of deaths. However, it's important to distinguish here that produce accounts for 27% of all deaths, but animal products accounts for all of the rest. That's 73% of all food borne illness coming from animal products.

You are far more likely to die from food borne illness caused by animal products; especially agricultural animals.

Re: Edible insects role in transmission of parasitic diseases to humans (2019)

#448

Post by steve_adams_86 »

thelittleone wrote: post #62
steve_adams_86 wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ll pick the salad over the steak any day, though. Above all I’d love to see better technology and attention for food safety, though. It’s stunning to see how many people suffer from food born illness today — something I’d thought was far more under control up until my mid 30s. It’s better under many circumstances and I’m not going to pretend it’s anything like it has been in the past. However, we could do much, muc…

Why, for example over say grass fed, organic steak?

Health concerns around animal products are not dramatically reduced between organic and non-organic agriculture.

It's better, but it's still not good. I don't drink organic alcohol, either; it's harmful to your health no matter how you slice it.

Re: Edible insects role in transmission of parasitic diseases to humans (2019)

#449

Post by steve_adams_86 »

markdown wrote: post #63
steve_adams_86 wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn’t it also the case that a lot of these contaminations in produce (like leafy greens) are caused by animal manure being used to fertilize the produce? Without manure being used the risk is diminished by orders of magnitude.

Only little backyard operations use animal manure. No large food chain will carry greens grown in animal manure.

Here in Canada we have pretty heavy application of manure, primarily in spring and fall. It's part of how we replenish soils at small and large scales.

I suspect we rarely grow greens immediately after applications, but to say only backyard operations use animal manure isn't true.

Evidently this is a common and well-researched practice in the USA as well: https://www.researchgate.net/publication/286297896_Animal_Ma...

Re: Edible insects role in transmission of parasitic diseases to humans (2019)

#450

Post by landemva »

ZeroGravitas wrote: post #145
justthinkhn wrote: post #119

Don’t eat the bugs. You have an innate disgust reaction to bugs and to the idea of eating them. It evolved over millions of years. Heed nature’s warning. They only eat bugs in places where it was historically necessary due to extreme famine. These activists trying to get you to eat bugs don’t have your best interests at heart. Eat meat. It is one of the great liberties man enjoys.

What's with the sudden uptick in people talking about eating bugs and eating meat (and liberties, billionaires, elites?)? Those two things aren't the only two options, and no one is forcing anyone to do anything, which makes me think this is some attempt by the meat industry to paint all the people who are telling you to eat less meat (like your doctor) as authoritarian lunatics out to undermine civilization.

I thought this was just speculative until I was recently in a Hilton that had the changing video displays in the lobby and elevators. The displays were promoting their 'sustainable' pasta with crickets dish in the restaurant.
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