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What Beirut was like before the war (2019)

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Re: What Beirut was like before the war (2019)

#201

Post by blibble »

Beltalowda wrote: post #191
ClumsyPilot wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I always wonder why many democracies devolve into politicians just looting I am very concerned that US/UK appear to be decolving for the last 10 years. The standards of acceptable behaviour from politicians have definately gone down.

I am somewhat optimistic about the UK situation; in the end, Boris was at least held accountable, and by his own party. It was too late, and he got away with far too much in my opinion, but in the end a line was drawn and was told to bugger off. Incidents with "colourful" PMs are not unheard off, e.g. Churchill was widely criticised for various antics which are not all that dissimilar to Boris' antics. This of course…

it's all from the property of parliamentary systems that the leader can be removed easily

presidental systems are really quite awful in practice

Re: What Beirut was like before the war (2019)

#202

Post by ROARosen »

_nedR wrote: post #116
nemesisj wrote: post #4

I follow the referenced instagram account and I actually find it depressing. I've probably visited Beirut 20+ times over the last 7 years. Last visit was summer of 2019, so haven't been since COVID. My company has an office there. It's one of my favorite cities in the world. It's also one of the most heartbreaking situations in economic and humanitarian terms. The country has experienced one of the worst currency cri…

It is also being ripped apart by external actors - Iran, Israel, France, Palestine, Saudi Arabia, Syria, United States and I am probably missing others.

External actors, hmmm... I believe you mixed that up with internal actors like Hezbolla and others, who have a tight grip on the countries political system.

Re: What Beirut was like before the war (2019)

#203

Post by ROARosen »

rougka wrote: post #198
babarock wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your description of Lebanon is correct, but incomplete. - Lebanon (as an independent state) has been created in 1920, right after WW1 by the French "colonialists" specifically to draw an enclave of non-muslim minority in the country. It's classic Divide&Conquer strategy. - The PLO (Palestinian Islamists) did try to set up an Islamic state in the country, but they were aided, or at least encouraged through inaction, b…

Since when are the PLO considered an Islamist movement?

From Wikipedia[0]:

Under President Arafat, the Fatah-dominated Palestinian Authority adopted the 2003 Amended Basic Law, which stipulates Islam as the sole official religion in Palestine and the principles of Islamic sharia as a principal source of legislation. The draft Constitution contains the same provisions. The draft Constitution was formulated by a Constitutional Committee, established by Arafat in 1999 and endorsed by the PLO.

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestine_Liberation_Organizat...

Re: What Beirut was like before the war (2019)

#204

Post by napmo »

ROARosen wrote: post #190
guelo wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every country neighboring Israel is a mess since Israel tries to destabilize them to make them weak so that Israel can be the regional superpower.

Last time I checked the leader of Hezbolla, which is part of the government of Lebanon said: "There is no solution to the conflict in this region except with the disappearance of Israel." Not the other way around.

Confronting the aggressor, Israel, is the best way to resolve the conflict of Palestine and the neighboring countries.

Re: What Beirut was like before the war (2019)

#206

Post by rr888 »

Theodores wrote: post #179
rr888 wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Poland is an example Poland has been around over a thousand years. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christianization_of_Poland

I think you were a little bit trigger happy with that. Show me where Poland was on the map before the Western powers drew it on the map after WW1. Much like Lebanon which has cultural heritage going back, so does Poland. But maps might not reflect that.

Take your pick https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingdom_of_Poland

Re: What Beirut was like before the war (2019)

#207

Post by suzzer99 »

suoduandao2 wrote: post #170
suzzer99 wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a whole, "trust the experts" has a much better track record than "google what you want to be true".

A better track record according to whom, the experts? It's one thing when an expert in biblical study tells you not to do your own research. When the same instructions come from an institution deferring its authority to the scientific method, someone's very obviously gone off the rails.

Should a random person with no scientific background or familiarity with medical studies trust their doctor and the overwhelming consensus of epidemiologists and virologists over Joe Rogan and a two hour youtube video? Yes, clearly. That this is even up for debate shows how insane things are right now..

Re: What Beirut was like before the war (2019)

#208

Post by sportslife »

Theodores wrote: post #179
rr888 wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Poland is an example Poland has been around over a thousand years. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christianization_of_Poland

I think you were a little bit trigger happy with that. Show me where Poland was on the map before the Western powers drew it on the map after WW1. Much like Lebanon which has cultural heritage going back, so does Poland. But maps might not reflect that.

Most of the maps in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Poland or clicking around https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingdom_of_Poland suggest Poland has borders about as stable as any country.

Sure parts of what is now Russia have been part of Poland before, but the center is surprising stable.

Re: What Beirut was like before the war (2019)

#209

Post by guelo »

rayiner wrote: post #150
azth wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree that Muslims want democracy (I'm Muslim). Present day democracy generally contradicts and is against Islam, so I'm not sure where you're getting your information from.

I’m from a Muslim country, and I think they do want democracy. What they don’t want is liberal democracy like in the west. Shadi Hamid has been instrumental in helping me understand the distinction between the two things. Here’s a good example: https://mobile.twitter.com/shadihamid/status/144363599537580... . More generally: https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2016/08/shadi-hamid-on-i... What (most) Muslims want is s…

This is also why the West generally supported or stayed quiet about the violent coup that took out the Muslim Brotherhood, Egypt's only democratically elected government. We value liberalism even if it's at the point of a gun over democracy.

Re: What Beirut was like before the war (2019)

#210

Post by Beltalowda »

blibble wrote: post #201
Beltalowda wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am somewhat optimistic about the UK situation; in the end, Boris was at least held accountable, and by his own party. It was too late, and he got away with far too much in my opinion, but in the end a line was drawn and was told to bugger off. Incidents with "colourful" PMs are not unheard off, e.g. Churchill was widely criticised for various antics which are not all that dissimilar to Boris' antics. This of course…

it's all from the property of parliamentary systems that the leader can be removed easily presidental systems are really quite awful in practice

I actually think that's a comparatively minor detail, and not all that important here. The biggest issue that has often been discussed is the first past the post constituencies/districts/states both systems share. Neither Trump nor Boris would have become President or PM without that, simply on account of voters having more options to cast a meaningful vote for (UK also does a little bit better than the US in this regard).
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