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Can the Visa-Mastercard duopoly be broken?

economist.com

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Re: Can the Visa-Mastercard duopoly be broken?

#401

Post by cthalupa »

vimy wrote: post #337
yieldcrv wrote: post #245

Earlier quoted context omitted.

biiig asterisk on that is necessary basically friends in the same country using a select few major banks are likely to have instant sepa available between them and it seem like the normal thing, while the reality is that instant-sepa is a massive patch work of availability between countries, banks, currencies an outsider to the EU trying to do business is unlikely to be a part of a social circle where everyone is usi…

Normal SEPA is max 2 days and usually it takes one. That’s not what I would call super slow.

When one of the parent comments that spawned this thread talks about transactions clearing faster than it takes to put the phone down after initiating it, it's quite a few orders of magnitude slower.

Re: Can the Visa-Mastercard duopoly be broken?

#402

Post by cesarb »

andersonmvd wrote: post #366
novok wrote: post #334

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How does it work with travellers & tourists then?

Credit card is still common, all good. I've seen an exception though. If you're in a "tourist destination" area, then no worries, I'm sure they will offer credit card as a payment option to keep you in business, but it's likely to be more expensive than paying using PIX. When I was in the south of Brazil I used the "iFood" app (biggest food delivery app in Brazil) and I could only pay using PIX. In other regions, oth…

> After having your account, you have to register it using specific types of identifier, for example your mobile phone.

AFAIK, you only have to register if you want to receive payments with a short identifier (like your CPF, which is the Brazilian equivalent of the USA's SSN, or your phone number), and even without registering you can receive them using your full bank account number (the registration exists just to map the identifier to the bank account number); you don't need to register to send payments, having a bank account is enough.

Re: Can the Visa-Mastercard duopoly be broken?

#404

Post by brewdad »

lotsofpulp wrote: post #318
kccqzy wrote: post #302

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Zelle is not always instant. There are two ways for a Zelle transaction to clear. The fast one goes through the Visa network, the same network for credit cards and debit cards. The slow ones goes through ACH, which takes several days. It is generally not possible for two recipients to know which network Zelle will use beforehand. ADDENDUM: The official marketing page for Zelle at https://www.zellepay.com/faq/how-long…

Interesting, I did not know that! It’s always worked instantly for me, even got a few thousand dollar transfers.

My credit union has a $250 per day cap and $500 per week. It really limits Zelle's usefulness.

Re: Can the Visa-Mastercard duopoly be broken?

#405

Post by smw »

refurb wrote: post #376
AlexandrB wrote: post #235

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's also available in Canada through Interac. I'm still shocked when I go to the US and have to sign for a credit card transaction. Last time I did that in Canada was when Bush was president.

That has more to do with a foreign credit card. I haven’t signed in the US for a credit card transaction in at least 5 or more years. I do if I use my card outside the US.

You don't ever eat in a sit down restaurant or a bar?

Re: Can the Visa-Mastercard duopoly be broken?

#406

Post by brewdad »

GekkePrutser wrote: post #298
AlexandrB wrote: post #235

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's also available in Canada through Interac. I'm still shocked when I go to the US and have to sign for a credit card transaction. Last time I did that in Canada was when Bush was president.

Same here in Europe. I've not signed my card for more than a decade because I've never been asked to provide a signature.

You at least have a PIN with your cc. In the US, it's signature or...nothing. Almost everywhere it's a tap or insert the chip. Still a mag stripe swipe in a few places but that's becoming more rare.

Re: Can the Visa-Mastercard duopoly be broken?

#407

Post by cthalupa »

GekkePrutser wrote: post #357
novok wrote: post #332

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your going to pay with some sort of payment card, and credit cards are easy to sign up for and less hassle to use with payments than debit cards, which require you to tap in a pin all the time. Also less fraud protection, etc.

Here in Europe it's the complete opposite. They're hard to sign up for (banks don't like giving them) and you get registered for the loan which means you will have a harder time getting a mortgage or car loan. The more loans you already have the harder it gets. I heard in the US it works the opposite way. And the pin is required here on both (and rightly so IMO to protect against skimming). Only for minor contactless…

>They're hard to sign up for (banks don't like giving them) and you get registered for the loan which means you will have a harder time getting a mortgage or car loan. The more loans you already have the harder it gets. I heard in the US it works the opposite way.

In the US, loans are distinct from lines of credit and credit cards. Just having a credit card won't make it easier for you to get a loan, but having a history of on time payments while making use of the credit cards will increase your credit score. Having high utilization on your cards will decrease your credit score. Mortgages will take a variety of factors into account, with credit score being among them.

>The only reason I have one is that my work insists that I get an Amex due to some dirty deal they have. Which is a horrible card for traveling in Europe, nobody accepts it besides hotels. Try getting a taxi in Paris for example

I've actually been quite successful in utilizing my Amex card across roughly two dozen countries in Europe and Asia, so this doesn't really match my experience. I haven't specifically tried to use it for a taxi in Paris, however. I do keep a Visa in my wallet in case I need it, but my bigger issue has been places that don't take cards at all, and having to carry cash. Cash only locations are basically nonexistent in the US - even the smallest hole in the wall type places and random food stalls in gas stations tend to allow for cards ever since Square became popular.

Re: Can the Visa-Mastercard duopoly be broken?

#408

Post by brewdad »

justinc8687 wrote: post #391
vimy wrote: post #342

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When you know someone’s bank account number you can only send them money. This issue simply isn’t possible.

That's not true. As a business, at least, I can run an ACH Debit[0] with just a routing number, account number and name. NACHA rules prohibit this, but nothing programmatically prevents this from happening. [0] https://plaid.com/resources/ach/how-does-an-ach-transfer-wor... .

u/vimy was talking about European banks. There is no "pull" there. People freely share their account info because one can only push money in with that info.

Re: Can the Visa-Mastercard duopoly be broken?

#409

Post by krisboyz781 »

tossl568 wrote: post #124
rvz wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

None of the mentioned coins / solutions: Bitcoin, Bitcoin Cash, Lightning Network, Ethereum, Layer 2 solutions are even close to being a credible alternative to the Visa-Mastercard duopoly. (Also, Lightning is not Bitcoin) No business wants to use a volatile asset that loses its value when a person or institution refunds and immediately sells hundreds of thousands of Bitcoin(s) and takes the whole market down with it…

Every lightning channel update is a valid Bitcoin transaction that can be broadcast at any time by either party for final settlement. Lightning is absolutely Bitcoin. You can use the lightning network as very cheap fiat rails if you don't want to deal with Bitcoin or it's volatility. Look at LN/Taro.

No post body was provided.

Re: Can the Visa-Mastercard duopoly be broken?

#410

Post by cthalupa »

einpoklum wrote: post #167
xboxnolifes wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would I not use a credit card? It's essentially a better debit card in every scenario, except for when paying with a credit card has an additional fee.

1. Extra hassle of interaction with a second company other than your bank, extra credentials, tracking balances, etc. etc. When I was living in the Netherlands I had my bank-account-attached Maestro card (or sometimes cash) and that was that. Except when foreign companies needed a credit card. 2. Fees. The whole point of credit cards - for the CC companies of course - is fees.

As others have noted, basically every bank in the US offers credit cards, but I do make use of American Express as my primary purchasing method, and for me this is a feature and not a bug.

They offer excellent customer service, the concierge offering has done quite a few excellent things for me (for free!), every time I have had to perform a chargeback the experience has been painless and the investigation concluded quickly, they generally have promotions related to merchants I frequent, etc. It's a much better experience as a customer than any bank I have ever had an account with.

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