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Gen Z have 86% less purchasing power compared to baby boomers in their twenties

consumeraffairs.com

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Re: Gen Z have 86% less purchasing power compared to baby boomers in their twenties

#241

Post by ceejayoz »

WalterBright wrote: post #221
ceejayoz wrote: post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Public+private spending on healthcare in the US is 2-3x that of public+private spending on healthcare in the rest of the OECD. See the chart at https://data.oecd.org/healthres/health-spending.htm ; we pay more in taxes than any other OECD nation does total for healthcare, and then pile individual spending on top of that .

The US government does a lot to increase health care costs. For one example, the government empowers the AMA to strictly limit the number of seats in medical schools, the purpose being to limit the supply of doctors to keep their fees high.

You're skipping off to a different argument.

You asserted "Just because it's 'free' doesn't mean you aren't paying plenty for it", but the places where it's "free" are paying less. You're highlighting issues specific to the American system in an apparent attempt to argue against European-style systems, which is... odd.

Re: Gen Z have 86% less purchasing power compared to baby boomers in their twenties

#242

Post by arcticbull »

nerdponx wrote: post #100
arcticbull wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As usual, there's a few chart crimes in here. Chart 1 shows CPI and inflation adjusted wages on the same graph? Why? Inflation adjusted wages already take into account CPI. There's no sensible reason to plot these two on the same graph. The caption is "wages are up 80% but that didn't keep up with living costs" - you cannot draw that inference from this graph. This graph actually shows that in fact wages grew faster…

> If you really slice it quintile, the bottom quintile of millenials is much worse off - that's what it looks like when you massacre the social safety net. But millenials as a whole are just as well off as previous generations. This I think warrants more than a footnote. A return to extreme class stratification is really quite bad , not just for those individuals affected but for society overall.

I completely agree. That's also why I think it's important to paint a picture that's as accurate and faithful as possible.

Re: Gen Z have 86% less purchasing power compared to baby boomers in their twenties

#243

Post by s1artibartfast »

falcolas wrote: post #112
krustyburger wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Plenty of low-mileage 90s cars are on the market. If you’re being sincere, just filter by low mileage and single owner and you’ll find your dream car.

Gimme something with '20's safety and fuel economy, and '90's features otherwise. Or, even better, an electric car without the computer screen on the inside. I remember 90's cars safety and gas mileage, and I emphatically don't want that.

safety has improved, but gas mileage for small cars was great. 90'2 and 00's had lots of compacts that got 40+ mpg highway.

Re: Gen Z have 86% less purchasing power compared to baby boomers in their twenties

#244

Post by rrrrrrrrrrrryan »

koboll wrote: post #101

Some of these charts are atrocious chart crimes. This one is particularly bad: https://i.imgur.com/hfHmvhP.png

Jesus Christ, the person who made this chart needs to accept Tufte into their life.

Re: Gen Z have 86% less purchasing power compared to baby boomers in their twenties

#245

Post by nerdponx »

Panzer04 wrote: post #212
phonon wrote: post #105

The author apparently has no idea how to do CPI calculations. She somehow seems to be calculating inflation adjusted wage increases to CPI changes. Rather-- Median Family income in 1970 was $9,870 [0] Median Family income in 2021 was $79,900 [1] CPI in 1970 was 38.8 [2] CPI in 2021 was 271.0 Ratio of incomes = 8.1 Ratio of CPI = 6.98 So household income has increased more than inflation. Median household income might…

I've lost quite a bit of respect for some of the HN community here - this should be obviously wrong, we obviously aren't buying 86% less today than we were in the past. The title's premise is so outlandish it deserves at least a little bit of critical thought... But because it confirms some previous biases (even if at a completely different and more extreme scale), more than I expected are acting as if this is true.

Why should hackers have any idea about economics? Not everyone can be a subject matter expert on everything, and it's easy to be swayed on topics like this where emotions run high (rightly so) and anecdotal evidence is everywhere.

As for the actual number being outlandish, I don't think most people have a sense of what "86% less purchasing power" even means. People see " + less purchasing power" and that gets the eyeballs. "Hackers" are just as susceptible to this as any other non-experts.

Plus, plenty of people here do know what they're talking about, enough to call out the obvious problems in the article and charts.

Re: Gen Z have 86% less purchasing power compared to baby boomers in their twenties

#246

Post by rrrrrrrrrrrryan »

topynate wrote: post #108

This article is complete bullshit because it effectively corrects for inflation twice. The CPI is a measure of the nominal change in cost of a basket of goods. This should be compared, like for like, to nominal income, not inflation-adjusted income. The CPI was already used to adjust the income to which it's compared in this article!

Thank you for summing this up so succinctly. I knew they comparing these two numbers was wrong, but I couldn't quite articulate it.

Re: Gen Z have 86% less purchasing power compared to baby boomers in their twenties

#247

Post by collegeburner »

bawolff wrote: post #160
curo wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've heard this so often yet we left the UK for no other reason than the healthcare. My wife was pregnant and the experience from 0-7 months was so terrible, we flew to the US to have the child. Post-operative outcomes and survival rates in the US are far better than in the UK and many European countries. Statistics about better birth outcomes or higher longevity is best attributed to healthier lifestyles in Europe/U…

I don't think anyone disputes that us healthcare is better if you have the money.

then you can understand why those of us with better healthcare and money don't want to take a downgrade to a "universal" system that is better for ppl with no money but worse for others. most middle class ppl in America have decent healthcare as a job benefit so most of us don't want to change. this is why "if you like your doctor you can keep them" was an essential talking point for passing obamacare.

Re: Gen Z have 86% less purchasing power compared to baby boomers in their twenties

#248

Post by WalterBright »

slg wrote: post #224
WalterBright wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There is still something very wrong with the healthcare system in the US Government interference with the free market.

Is there a country you would point to as a good model for free market healthcare? Because healthcare seems like a market prone to be abused by market forces because the demand for it is often inelastic. For example, the free market price for insulin is basically infinite because type 1 diabetics need a constant supply of it or else they die. Judging by the price of insulin in the US compared to our peer nations, it s…

The US before 1968.

Insulin is heavily regulated by the FDA, making competition very difficult.

Re: Gen Z have 86% less purchasing power compared to baby boomers in their twenties

#249

Post by WalterBright »

modriano wrote: post #220
WalterBright wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There is still something very wrong with the healthcare system in the US Government interference with the free market.

I'm not so sure that is a sensible inference to draw. Government "interference" in healthcare in many countries where citizens both have greater access and report more satisfaction with the healthcare service they receive. Also, free markets really don't have much to say for people who don't have the money to trade in that market, and in the healthcare space, denying treatment to people just because they can't afford…

The US had a free market in health care in 1968, and there's simply no evidence to support your suspicions.

Re: Gen Z have 86% less purchasing power compared to baby boomers in their twenties

#250

Post by WalterBright »

ceejayoz wrote: post #241
WalterBright wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US government does a lot to increase health care costs. For one example, the government empowers the AMA to strictly limit the number of seats in medical schools, the purpose being to limit the supply of doctors to keep their fees high.

You're skipping off to a different argument. You asserted "Just because it's 'free' doesn't mean you aren't paying plenty for it", but the places where it's "free" are paying less . You're highlighting issues specific to the American system in an apparent attempt to argue against European-style systems, which is... odd.

The US does not have a free market in health care.
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