John Carmack: Best Programming Setup and IDE – Lex Fridman Podcast Clips • Hacker News Board

Re: John Carmack: Best Programming Setup and IDE – Lex Fridman Podcast Clips

#161

Post by koonsolo » Sat, Aug 13, 2022, 1:30 PM UTC

tingol wrote: post #117

koonsolo wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I ended up with the best of both worlds (subjective of course!). I use VSCode with a Vim plugin. I get all the best keystrokes from Vim, and the GUI of VSCode. For me, going to Vim would be worse, and going to plain VSCode would be worse.

I went the other way, as soon as VSCode-like language server protocol was available for neovim I dropped VSCode. Now I have the same speed with modern features too. In the end it's what's best for you that counts, having quality options helps a lot.

> In the end it's what's best for you that counts, having quality options helps a lot

I agree. I just can't stand the git CLI, and love the GitGraph plugin in VSCode. But like you say everyone has their preferences.

Re: John Carmack: Best Programming Setup and IDE – Lex Fridman Podcast Clips

#162

Post by robenkleene » Sat, Aug 13, 2022, 1:31 PM UTC

heynowheynow wrote: post #36

Barrin92 wrote: post #16

I'm one of the people he talks about who moved from diehard Emacs use slowly to more and more VSCode use largely due to the better UI experience around debugging and integration of a lot of modern tools. His point about features not being used when they're complicated to reach despite people claiming that they'll use them is a true observation in particular. You always can set up a lot of those features in your unix-…

VSCode is based on Electron, a glorified hack/resource hog of Chromium than even Github largely abandoned. It maybe "great" and mildly "popular" here and there, but it's built on a foundation of mud. Build native apps that work and are performant. With enough effort and care, a frictionless experience can be made with a TUI should some "Jetbrains" come along and try to make a commercial product out of it.

> It maybe "great" and mildly "popular" here and there

VS Code is not just mildly popular, it's significantly more than twice as popular as any text editor has ever been in the modern era.

Source, it's currently used by 74% of programmers (https://survey.stackoverflow.co/2022/#technology-most-popula...), the next highest text editor, since the survey started in 2015, was Sublime Text in its prime (2016) at 31%.

It's fair to call VS Code's popularity unprecedented and historic. And it's already being used to shape the future of the industry. E.g., we're watching the decline of local development right now (outside of specialized use cases) largely through VS Code's support for remote development features.

This is most likely just beginning of how VS Code will leverage its position to shape the future of programming.

Re: John Carmack: Best Programming Setup and IDE – Lex Fridman Podcast Clips

#163

Post by cal85 » Sat, Aug 13, 2022, 1:31 PM UTC

iamflimflam1 wrote: post #120

aborsy wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Several thousands for what time duration? That’s one month of rent. I would be interested in some estimates of revenue per audience.

We’ll of course - that is the trick - you need to repeat it consistently. There are people who do it and make a lot of money doing it (have a look at MrBeast as an example). Lex will he making an awful lot of money from his sponsorship - which is also where the big channels on YouTube make the majority of their money. If you can go to a marketing department and say “I’ll get your product in front of a captive audienc…

You didn’t answer the question.

Re: John Carmack: Best Programming Setup and IDE – Lex Fridman Podcast Clips

#164

Post by rfrey » Sat, Aug 13, 2022, 1:31 PM UTC

brtkdotse wrote: post #38

royjacobs wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think Carmack was mostly talking about regular Visual Studio as his IDE of choice, though. Not VSCode.

Visual Studio is to VSCode what car is to carpet.

So, one is too heavy to lift and the other one flies?

(agreed though. VS has been a beacon of light inside MS even in its darkest periods.)

Re: John Carmack: Best Programming Setup and IDE – Lex Fridman Podcast Clips

#165

Post by todd8 » Sat, Aug 13, 2022, 1:33 PM UTC

I've programmed for a long time. One of the best programmer's I've known actually had his own debugger. He was an OS kernel developer and carried the debugger with him from job to job; we were working on the new operating system at IBM that would become AIX. He was a bit of a nuisance in the large development organization because he would wander around the kernel in his debugger fixing code before others had even noticed the defects.

We were working on a distributed file system, and I had complained that we couldn't be expected to finish on the same deadline as the hardware device driver teams and the network stack teams. How would we even develop our software if we didn't have any working communication between machines? Well, my friend came to the rescue and wrote the kernel support for the NIC and a comm stack up to the level of UDP (having a debugger helped).

Eventually, the managers of the other departments that wouldn't cut my team any slack on our schedule started coming around to ask us for help because they were falling behind schedule. They were responsible for the official development of the network device drivers and networking, and it turned out they didn't have a working kernel debugger like we had (thanks to my friends personal one), so they had fallen behind schedule while we were already making good time on our distributed file system running on top of the our own hacked together temporary device drivers and networking code. I had to lend the teammate and his debugger to the other two teams to help them with their schedules.

Re: John Carmack: Best Programming Setup and IDE – Lex Fridman Podcast Clips

#166

Post by jessermeyer » Sat, Aug 13, 2022, 1:33 PM UTC

balfirevic wrote: post #147

jillesvangurp wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the point he made was rather the opposite. He works 10-12 hours a day, 60 hours a week, 6 days a week. He needs seven to eight hours of sleep, like a normal person. He specifically mentioned that he never was much into doing all-nighters and that he experimented with working different times of the day. So he'd start in the afternoon and then continue until deep in the night when he was younger whereas having…

> He works 10-12 hours a day, 60 hours a week, 6 days a week > Work life balance and taking care of his family is just part of that deal as well. I don't judge anyone for how they like to spend their time (and certainly admire Carmack), but what work/life balance? There isn't much except work there.

Work/life balance applies to people who would ordinarily not do their work if they did not have to.

Re: John Carmack: Best Programming Setup and IDE – Lex Fridman Podcast Clips

#167

Post by koonsolo » Sat, Aug 13, 2022, 1:36 PM UTC

jalino23 wrote: post #105

koonsolo wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I ended up with the best of both worlds (subjective of course!). I use VSCode with a Vim plugin. I get all the best keystrokes from Vim, and the GUI of VSCode. For me, going to Vim would be worse, and going to plain VSCode would be worse.

except macros doesnt work! and the multiline editing from vs code doesnt work anymore. unless you got both to work?

For me I don't use macro's that much. I remeber they worked fine in the Visual Studio plugin, but not sure VSCode. If I really need it for a file, I can always quickly open gvim itself. If you use it in your daily workflow, then it might be an issue indeed. But I don't see a reason why a plugin couldn't offer that (like the Visual Studio plugin).

Vim multiline editing works fine :). Not sure what the VSCode offers thoug (maybe I'm missing out)

Re: John Carmack: Best Programming Setup and IDE – Lex Fridman Podcast Clips

#168

Post by tren » Sat, Aug 13, 2022, 1:38 PM UTC

tpmx wrote: post #155

imron wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

VS6 was such a great product.

I tried out VS 2019 last year on a whim. The last time I used VS before that was in the early 2000s (probably 6.0). It was a surprisingly bad experience - weirdly slow even on a high performance PC and so much clutter by default. Tried out VS 2022 just now. First impressions are better.

2022 was the first VS in 64 bit, the increase in responsiveness was enough to make me switch back from rider

Re: John Carmack: Best Programming Setup and IDE – Lex Fridman Podcast Clips

#169

Post by robenkleene » Sat, Aug 13, 2022, 1:39 PM UTC

rvdginste wrote: post #68

In 2000-2006 I implemented garbage collectors in C on Linux. I used Emacs and GDB, and likely also DDD and GDB from within Emacs. I don't think there was anything better back then. It's been a long time since I used C, but I wonder whether VSCode really gives a better experience than Emacs. Nowadays you can use Emacs with an LSP server, which is likely also what VSCode is doing. And there are Emacs distributions like…

> Regarding the comment about the debugging. For me personally, I always take the time to study the code first before I start debugging. A lot of times I already find the problem by just reading the code and even if that is not the case, I have a much better understanding about how the code is supposed to behave and that makes the debugging session a lot more useful.

> And I say that because I have the impression that it is common for developers to dive straight into a debugging session without a good understanding of what the code is doing or trying to do. It's like they see the sympton and want to fix the sympton instead of fixing the core cause.

Did you watch the video? He spends a significant amount of time talking specifically about why he thinks what you are saying here is misguided.

Re: John Carmack: Best Programming Setup and IDE – Lex Fridman Podcast Clips

#170

Post by rascul » Sat, Aug 13, 2022, 1:43 PM UTC

heynowheynow wrote: post #36

Barrin92 wrote: post #16

I'm one of the people he talks about who moved from diehard Emacs use slowly to more and more VSCode use largely due to the better UI experience around debugging and integration of a lot of modern tools. His point about features not being used when they're complicated to reach despite people claiming that they'll use them is a true observation in particular. You always can set up a lot of those features in your unix-…

VSCode is based on Electron, a glorified hack/resource hog of Chromium than even Github largely abandoned. It maybe "great" and mildly "popular" here and there, but it's built on a foundation of mud. Build native apps that work and are performant. With enough effort and care, a frictionless experience can be made with a TUI should some "Jetbrains" come along and try to make a commercial product out of it.

Github didn't abandon Electron. Github created Electron for their editor called Atom. Microsoft later used Electron for VS Code. Microsoft bought Github. Github is sunsetting Atom (not Electron) to focus on VS Code.

https://github.blog/2022-06-08-sunsetting-atom/