Live data from Hacker News

Study finds link between 'forever chemicals' in cookware and liver cancer

insider.com

61–70 of 412 posts

Re: Study finds link between 'forever chemicals' in cookware and liver cancer

#61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why take the risk for a minor convenience? Get stainless steel cookware and you’ll quickly learn how to avoid sticking by controlling temperature.

Not really. And I say this as someone who owns and frequently cooks with stainless steel, cast iron, and non-stick, I have for decades and also worked in a professional kitchen at one point. Some things are always better in stainless or cast iron... I tend towards meats in cast iron and veggies in stainless, though it really depends. Other things are easiest in nonstick, but can be learned in stainless, like eggs sun…

> Eggs overeasy without breaking the yolk is really hard though.

This is strange to hear from a professional chef. I cook eggs overeasy on my cast iron all the time. What works for me is preheating the pan on moderate heat for a minute or two, putting in a bit of butter, and using a metal spatula. Haven't had a broken egg in forever.

I've certainly found you need less oil to prevent sticking on a well-seasoned cast iron compared to others. It really is a semi-nonstick layer. I've made eggs on mine with no butter just to test it out and with the right heat they didn't stick.

But I guess if you have other tools that are easier for the same result, there's not much reason to learn the harder one. Personally I like having a small collection of cast iron I can do anything with, one part saving space and one part just having a thing for cast iron.

Re: Study finds link between 'forever chemicals' in cookware and liver cancer

#62
It set us up the DOCUMENTARY for great justice

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt7689910/

Teflon is the most biologically sinister chemical.

We need to hold the entire petrol-chemical industry to account.

A dear friend of mine is the niece of one of the most successful board members of Shell. Shell is likely the most corrupt-environmentally-speaking companies on the globe. (history of

When we went to dinner, they were sharing all their big-game hunting trophy pics from Africa where they were able to kill endangered species and had no qualms about sharing their exploits (think the EDIT -- it was Don Trump jr. (I totally dyslexia-'d the presidents sons, I did not do that on purpose. Sorry Hunter. (Crack is whack) Hunter Biden pic with the tail of a rhino/elephant? type pics. and it wasnt just one... NUMEROUS animals.)

https://duckduckgo.com/?t=ffab&q=don+trump+jr+elephant+tail+...

Petro-chems are boon and bane.

This industry needs a reckoning.

Re: Study finds link between 'forever chemicals' in cookware and liver cancer

#63
post #9
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the end goal is to not use a similar analogue. The problematic chemicals are fluorosurfactants used in production, and they are not actually useful in the final pan. Manufacturers are working on getting rid of them: https://www.solvay.com/en/article/eliminating-pfas As far as I know, PTFE itself is also a “forever chemical”, but it’s an extremely inert polymer and is unlikely to be particularly dangerous as l…

> Manufacturers are working on getting rid of them. It might be more ethical to stop selling the dangerous product until a replacement can be found, but I’m not a huge chemical manufacturer.

Many stopped selling a generation ago, but the chemicals last longer than a generation…

Re: Study finds link between 'forever chemicals' in cookware and liver cancer

#64
post #2

The study didn’t actually find anything related to cookware. Modern Teflon in the US doesn’t expose people to PFOA/PFOS like old version did due to new regulations. The chemicals could also be entering peoples body’s through drinking water or bioaccumulation in meat or plants. You should throw away nonstick cookware from before 2013, but new nonstick cookware sold in the US does not have PFOA. I believe the EU follow…

Why take the risk for a minor convenience? Get stainless steel cookware and you’ll quickly learn how to avoid sticking by controlling temperature.

I treasure my stainless-clad aluminum (stainless by itself has very poor thermal performance) pans above almost all my other possessions, but I wouldn't call them nonstick. Sometimes it's a feature. You can use the fond (the browned bits stuck to the pan) to make a pan sauce. If you want a plastic-free nonstick pan, better options are cast iron, carbon steel, and ceramic. All have their own downsides, but well-seasoned cast iron and carbon steel are incredibly nonstick with just a little bit of fat when hot.

Re: Study finds link between 'forever chemicals' in cookware and liver cancer

#65
post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yup. Chefs rarely use nonstick cookware outside of baking or specifically making omelettes. For the majority of their uses, it's either stainless, cast iron, or enameled cast iron. Non-stick got its foothold when the feds went on their "fat is bad for you" kick. They took all the fat out and added sugar to products to fix the texture. Proteins stick to steel when the steel isn't sufficiently hot before food is placed…

> Chefs rarely use nonstick cookware outside of baking or specifically making omelette. Citation needed? It sounds implausible to me that a majority of professional cooks seek to make their own job harder when they've got seven other dishes to make by tending a nonnonstick pan.

These pans are only not nonstick if used incorrectly. Carbon steel is often used in professional kitchens which develops a nonstick coating called “seasoning”. And if stainless is hot enough, it’s also not very prone to sticking.

Re: Study finds link between 'forever chemicals' in cookware and liver cancer

#66
post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just read that rainwater around the world is unsafe to drink because of PFAS contamination. https://phys.org/news/2022-08-rainwater-unsafe-due-chemicals...

Rainwater pretty much distills itself as it evaporates. I didn’t read the article but it seems like they’d new some new physics to get it into rain.

The PFAS that show up in rain get there by also having a vapor pressure sufficient for atmospheric transport. They evaporate and condense with the rain. These chemicals aren't Teflon itself but other polyfluorinated molecules, used as intermediates in Teflon product production or for other purposes.

Re: Study finds link between 'forever chemicals' in cookware and liver cancer

#67

It set us up the DOCUMENTARY for great justice https://www.imdb.com/title/tt7689910/ Teflon is the most biologically sinister chemical. We need to hold the entire petrol-chemical industry to account. A dear friend of mine is the niece of one of the most successful board members of Shell. Shell is likely the most corrupt-environmentally-speaking companies on the globe. (history of When we went to dinner, they were sha…

Humanity probably needs plastics, I can’t see how we go back.

Also, it’s interesting to consider whether >50% sugar induced obesity rates are having a larger effect on quality of life…

Re: Study finds link between 'forever chemicals' in cookware and liver cancer

#68
post #40

Cast iron pans are cheap, will outlive you, and work nearly as well with enough seasoning / butter :)

Cast iron is also very heavy, and hard to clean if you get anything stuck to it. You can’t really soak or wash it with soap/water without re-seasoning it or it’ll rust. It has its upsides if you put in the work. I’ve given up and opted for mid-range non-stick (coated steel and/or copper, not anodized aluminum) or high end stainless.

Carbon steel builds the same coating but isn’t all that heavy.

> hard to clean if you get anything stuck to it

Easy fix, just don’t get anything stuck to it. If you learn how to use these correctly, this becomes essentially a non issue.

Re: Study finds link between 'forever chemicals' in cookware and liver cancer

#69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why take the risk for a minor convenience? Get stainless steel cookware and you’ll quickly learn how to avoid sticking by controlling temperature.

Not really. And I say this as someone who owns and frequently cooks with stainless steel, cast iron, and non-stick, I have for decades and also worked in a professional kitchen at one point. Some things are always better in stainless or cast iron... I tend towards meats in cast iron and veggies in stainless, though it really depends. Other things are easiest in nonstick, but can be learned in stainless, like eggs sun…

I discovered a trick to use a sanding attachment for a drill to progressively polish my stainless steel frying pans to a mirror finish.

If you then put fish / eggs in it after heating up a generous amount of oil to >boiling, it effectively acts nearly as good as a brand new nonstick pan.

Mirrored finish is worse for some things (browning vegetables) but great for delicate tasks like French omelettes.

Re: Study finds link between 'forever chemicals' in cookware and liver cancer

#70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not really. And I say this as someone who owns and frequently cooks with stainless steel, cast iron, and non-stick, I have for decades and also worked in a professional kitchen at one point. Some things are always better in stainless or cast iron... I tend towards meats in cast iron and veggies in stainless, though it really depends. Other things are easiest in nonstick, but can be learned in stainless, like eggs sun…

I think that's a fair point. I don't cook anything that causes me a problem using stainless steel but I accept there may be cases where non-stick is essential. My earlier point could be expanded to: Make stainless steel your primary cookware and only fall back to a non-stick option when absolutely necessary. In doing so, you're risking far less exposure than someone who uses that stuff for everything they cook.

Nonstick is never absolutely necessary. It's a minor convenience over learning to control heat or washing a pan if you don't.
Post reply on HN