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Let websites framebust out of native apps

holovaty.com

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Re: Let websites framebust out of native apps

#111

Post by derefr »

kitsunesoba wrote: post #98
derefr wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And I have to say, I would be pretty irritated if every site demanded to open in my main browser. Many if not most links I tap are quick one and dones I’d prefer to not clutter up my tabs. Sure, but why does that have to imply that you get "per-app cookies, storage, etc"? What I want is a Safari tab as a modal temporarily overlaying the app. It is a tab of my regular web browser, with access to my regular web-brows…

I do agree that SFSafariViewController should use the newer style of sheet that can be pulled down on to be be dismissed. It makes more sense than the current navigation stack style presentation, and the extra context of the spawning app being visible around the top edges under the sheet would be helpful in app switcher. The reason SFSafariViewController switched to per-app containers is because the older behavior in…

> the older behavior in iOS 9/10 where it used the same environment as the browser proper was being rampantly abused for advertising/tracking purposes

How did this work, exactly? Was the app able to observe/interact with the SFSafariViewController in any way? In my mind, the SFSafariViewController should literally "be" a Safari tab, in the sense that once it's open, the spawning app has no more connection to it than it would have to a tab in Safari itself which it caused to open; other than the fact that this tab would be 1. modal on top of the app, like a sheet; and 2. the app would be told when you closed this sheet, so that it could pause anything actively going on "underneath" the sheet until it was closed.

(And, to be clear, the Safari tab would be running _in_ Safari, and just composited onto the sheet, rather than running inside the app process in any way. This is how OS file-pickers et al work, which is what I was trying to get across with that comparison.)

The closest analogy would actually be within the browser itself: one browser tab using JS window.open(target=_blank, opener=false) to open another browser tab within the same browsing profile, where the new tab loads a page from a different origin; where when that new tab gets focused, the original tab gets obscured, and so the page it has loaded is given a visibilityStateChanged event; followed by another one when you close the new tab and the original tab comes back to focus.

Re: Let websites framebust out of native apps

#112

Post by the_gipsy »

simscitizen wrote: post #9

It looks like Twitter is using SFSafariViewController for their in-app browser. This is the system-recommended way of creating an in-app browser. It prevents the embedding app (Twitter in this case) from reading website data and injecting JavaScript into the view. You can also break out of the session into Safari pretty trivially by hitting the Safari button in the lower right corner. Apps that implement a custom web…

Still, apps do this against the interest of the user, to keep them inside their app.

In some apps even if you find a setting that disables this "feature", they then don't open links not in my default browser (firefox) nor in safari, but chrome.

Re: Let websites framebust out of native apps

#113

Post by the_gipsy »

ocdtrekkie wrote: post #79
simscitizen wrote: post #9

It looks like Twitter is using SFSafariViewController for their in-app browser. This is the system-recommended way of creating an in-app browser. It prevents the embedding app (Twitter in this case) from reading website data and injecting JavaScript into the view. You can also break out of the session into Safari pretty trivially by hitting the Safari button in the lower right corner. Apps that implement a custom web…

So it sounds like the solution here is to not cater to Open Web Advocacy's particular flavor of advocacy as the article prescribes, but in fact, prohibit apps from using any webview except the official one provided by the OS.

Why do you come to that conclusion? The users want to open links in their browser - no matter if the link is in an email, chat message, or in an app.

Re: Let websites framebust out of native apps

#114

Post by mschuster91 »

> There was indeed a time when this argument made sense: the years before 2015, which is when iOS 9 introduced a global Back button conveniently solving the problem. And of course Android has its global Back button. These days this argument holds no water.

Oh of course it does hold water. On Samsung's pretty recent Active Tab 3, opening a link in an app (e.g. RIF) in Chrome takes ages (I recently timed it, 80 seconds) because Chrome for whatever goddamn reason thinks it has to reload all the icons for the 100+ tabs I have open every time Android's completely bonkers memory manager decides it wants to suspend Chrome in background.

Re: Let websites framebust out of native apps

#115

Post by liminvorous »

kitsunesoba wrote: post #14
simscitizen wrote: post #9

It looks like Twitter is using SFSafariViewController for their in-app browser. This is the system-recommended way of creating an in-app browser. It prevents the embedding app (Twitter in this case) from reading website data and injecting JavaScript into the view. You can also break out of the session into Safari pretty trivially by hitting the Safari button in the lower right corner. Apps that implement a custom web…

Came here to say this. Custom webviews like Facebook likes to use are another matter but SFSafariViewController is for all intents and purposes real Safari with per-app cookies, storage, etc to bust tracking. And I have to say, I would be pretty irritated if every site demanded to open in my main browser. Many if not most links I tap are quick one and dones I’d prefer to not clutter up my tabs.

On the other hand I am almost always annoyed at apps opening websites in SFSafariViewController, and would prefer to be able to completely disable it and have it always open in the real browser.

Re: Let websites framebust out of native apps

#116

Post by alickz »

kitsunesoba wrote: post #98
derefr wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And I have to say, I would be pretty irritated if every site demanded to open in my main browser. Many if not most links I tap are quick one and dones I’d prefer to not clutter up my tabs. Sure, but why does that have to imply that you get "per-app cookies, storage, etc"? What I want is a Safari tab as a modal temporarily overlaying the app. It is a tab of my regular web browser, with access to my regular web-brows…

I do agree that SFSafariViewController should use the newer style of sheet that can be pulled down on to be be dismissed. It makes more sense than the current navigation stack style presentation, and the extra context of the spawning app being visible around the top edges under the sheet would be helpful in app switcher. The reason SFSafariViewController switched to per-app containers is because the older behavior in…

>I do agree that SFSafariViewController should use the newer style of sheet that can be pulled down on to be be dismissed.

SFSafariViewController can be presented in the newer sheet modal style, it would seem Twitter specifically chose not to in this case.

Re: Let websites framebust out of native apps

#117

Post by ramblerman »

SergeAx wrote: post #105

I see almost no reason to use mobile apps for Facebook, Instagram or Twitter today. Just use mobile web browser instead. The only thing is a dark mode for Facebook, but I believe it is achievable via DarkReader plugin for Firefox. Also, ad blockers are more or less working in browser, although Facebook is actively counteracts.

A lot of them detect it and try to force you. It's malicious as hell, but somehow allowed.

For example reddit won't open a link it deems +18 through the web browser, and redirects you to use the app.

Re: Let websites framebust out of native apps

#118

Post by benhurmarcel »

josephg wrote: post #110
kelnos wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why should this clutter up your tabs, though? Hitting the back button/making the back gesture should (given a sane implementation) close the tab and return you to the native app where you clicked the link, no?

This already happens when apps open links in safari. There’s a little back button in the top left of the screen to go back to the app which opened that webpage.

This doesn't close the tab though.

Re: Let websites framebust out of native apps

#119

Post by SergeAx »

ramblerman wrote: post #117
SergeAx wrote: post #105

I see almost no reason to use mobile apps for Facebook, Instagram or Twitter today. Just use mobile web browser instead. The only thing is a dark mode for Facebook, but I believe it is achievable via DarkReader plugin for Firefox. Also, ad blockers are more or less working in browser, although Facebook is actively counteracts.

A lot of them detect it and try to force you. It's malicious as hell, but somehow allowed. For example reddit won't open a link it deems +18 through the web browser, and redirects you to use the app.

I saw that on Reddit couple of times. I just close the tab in that case: there's nothing 18+ on Reddit that worth installing their app.

Re: Let websites framebust out of native apps

#120

Post by SergeAx »

ramblerman wrote: post #117
SergeAx wrote: post #105

I see almost no reason to use mobile apps for Facebook, Instagram or Twitter today. Just use mobile web browser instead. The only thing is a dark mode for Facebook, but I believe it is achievable via DarkReader plugin for Firefox. Also, ad blockers are more or less working in browser, although Facebook is actively counteracts.

A lot of them detect it and try to force you. It's malicious as hell, but somehow allowed. For example reddit won't open a link it deems +18 through the web browser, and redirects you to use the app.

I wonder, by the way, why Reddit's "install app or continue with browser" popup isn't blocked by uBlock Origin. It is clearly an ad, and very malicious indeed.
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