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“Autistic people can’t acknowledge when they’re wrong”

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Re: “Autistic people can’t acknowledge when they’re wrong”

#191

Post by larve »

sputr wrote: post #115
larve wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

thanks for reading, author here! the article is very much a response to a blame already expressed. People can be wrong about factual things, which can be verified. Otherwise it’s a difference of opinions. These are my thoughts on why differences of opinions get phrased as “autistic people just can’t admit when they are wrong”, when myself and most autistic people I know in fact readily admit when we are wrong and mov…

I hope you take this as constructive criticism, as it's not intended to offend: Your post reads extremely arrogantly. It's a "I am very smart" type of communication style . None of the points you bring up are specific to autistic individuals. I'm allistic (as you put it) and, realistically, not that intelligent, but I experience the first two of your points on a regular basis. But I've learned to modify my handling o…

I totally understand, and I knew it would be perceived this way. If I can trust my colleagues and friends, I come across as very humble. This article is the first time I ever mentioned publicly how much time I put into learning technology.

The question is, when and how do I communicate that best without coming across as arrogant.

Re: “Autistic people can’t acknowledge when they’re wrong”

#192

Post by newsclues »

larve wrote: post #18
korijn wrote: post #3

It's interesting to me that all four examples put the blame with the other party. I hope it's just worded poorly or I am reading too much into it. Edit: I'm not saying that invalidates the article's content (in fact I recognize the situations from personal experience), but it doesn't really put a positive spin on it.

thanks for reading, author here! the article is very much a response to a blame already expressed. People can be wrong about factual things, which can be verified. Otherwise it’s a difference of opinions. These are my thoughts on why differences of opinions get phrased as “autistic people just can’t admit when they are wrong”, when myself and most autistic people I know in fact readily admit when we are wrong and mov…

Seems like autistic people won’t let go of being right on factual things and others can disagree, at least that’s how I feel sometimes.

Re: “Autistic people can’t acknowledge when they’re wrong”

#193

Post by shlant »

starkd wrote: post #91
jiggawatts wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sometimes the blame is with the other party. An uncomfortable truth we all pretend to ignore is that more than half the population is below average intelligence.[1] The comments in this blog post don't just apply to autistic people, but apply equally to people that are simply less wrong than average. An observation I made is that some people make correct statements approximately 90% of the time. This is waaaay above…

I think you might be confusing autistism with high intelligence. The two are very different. I'm not sure it's even remotely comparable. Most autistic truly autistic people have a severe deficit to the point they have a problem with basic navigation of the world. Not just inconvencies. There's a tendency to turn every difficulty into a syndrome. While reading the article, I had the distinct feeling the author was not…

I think you should probably do some more reading into Autism Spectrum Disorder. Your comment echos cliched and harmful ideas of what Autism is.

The reason "Spectrum" is in the name is because there is a wide range of ways it can manifest - from very severe on one end to less impactful (and in some ways beneficial depending on context) on the other. People who used to be referred to as having Asperger Syndrome for example are normally highly intelligent and capable individuals, many of whom you'd have no idea had Autism if you met them.

Please do not continue to spread this kind of thinking - it is very antiquated. I also don't know why you would doubt someone is Autistic based on a single blog post.

Re: “Autistic people can’t acknowledge when they’re wrong”

#194

Post by larve »

rendall wrote: post #176
larve wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Author here, thanks for reading. I didn’t give much information about my life, but I am pretty adept at playing all these games. So much so that I thought there was no way I could be autistic because of how many friends and business relationships I had. Until it hit me that I spent my 20ies doing what you suggest, which is studying the heck out of these things. But it stops at engineering, where I try to be very open…

Given the headline, I thought it would be an article about what it looks like when you acknowledge that you are wrong and why people might not understand that you are, in fact, acknowledging when you are wrong. Instead, it was an entire article that not once acknowledged that you could be wrong, nor what it looks like when you do acknowledge it. It detailed about how, actually, you're not usually wrong. This article…

Thanks for reading. I agree, this article is about the times when things escalated, and I didn’t think I was wrong, or more precisely, didn’t even get to the point where I could be wrong.

When I’m wrong I just say “oh you’re right, good point” and move on. It’s very easy to do.

Re: “Autistic people can’t acknowledge when they’re wrong”

#195

Post by ebjaas_2022 »

Repost of an earlier comment I made, on a different thread:

I think the difference is that an autistic person will see reality like this:

  |   O                                O   |
  | ----- ( inner landscape (fact) ) ----- |
  |   |                                |   |
  |  / \                              / \  |
While the non-autistic person will see it like this:

  |   O                                                           O   |
  | ----- ( inner landscape (fact) ) ( inner landscape (fact) ) ----- |
  |   |                                                           |   |
  |  / \                                                         / \  |
The non-autistic person will always assume that there are two inner landscapes at play, in any given social situation, two versions of reality, if you will, and two sets of facts. And they will assume that the other person sees it in the same way: They will assume that the other person also allows for two versions of reality, and two sets of facts.

The autistic person will, instead, view it as if there is one big unified shared reality between him and the other person, and one true fact, in any given situation. He will also assume that the other person sees it in the same way as himself.

The "double empathy problem" is that neither of them can see how the other person views the world. The non-autistic person cannot comprehend that the autistic person sees a single shared reality, and a single fact. Likewise, the autistic person cannot comprehend that the non-autistic person sees two different realities and two sets of facts.

Re: “Autistic people can’t acknowledge when they’re wrong”

#196

Post by ThrustVectoring »

denton-scratch wrote: post #165
mort96 wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Imagine you hear throughout your life that you can't admit you're wrong or that your _kind of person_ can't admit they're wrong. Wouldn't it be a sign of healthy introspection to dedicate time to analyze whether that's correct? And a fundamental requirement to admit to being wrong is, well, actually being wrong. If you analyze a situation and find that you're factually correct, you haven't failed to admit to being wr…

> Wouldn't it be a sign of healthy introspection to dedicate time to analyze whether that's correct? I wonder if Author is in fact autistic. It seems (not sure if I've got this right) that author wasn't diagnosed until his forties. I'd have expected a diagnosis of autism to occur pre-teen.

Mental health diagnoses pretty much only happen when the patient's life is impacted enough to convince the people involved in their life that there's a problem and figuring it out is necessary. If you get good enough grades, have a non-zero amount of friends, have a family and career that accommodates your random foibles, and generally manage your life well, then you can be as textbook mentally ill as you want without ever getting mental health professionals involved in your life.

As a relatively famous example, take Bill Gross, aka the "Bond King". He only realized he had Asperger's in his seventies when it was randomly the topic of a psychiatrist he was having dinner with. And why would he seek out some kind of diagnosis? He's happily married and running fantastically successful bond funds.

Re: “Autistic people can’t acknowledge when they’re wrong”

#197

Post by JohnHaugeland »

larve wrote: post #68
dusted wrote: post #19

I read this as being strongly opinionated and egocentric.. I want to call it "ausplaining", this tendency to go "no no, YOU don't understand ME (because I'm special, not because I'm wrong)" whenever we get ourselves into situations like the exemplified. I do this A LOT as well, and when people do stick with me for long enough, I often find that I'm either getting my point across by re-framing my explanation, or disco…

Author here, thanks for reading. I didn’t give much information about my life, but I am pretty adept at playing all these games. So much so that I thought there was no way I could be autistic because of how many friends and business relationships I had. Until it hit me that I spent my 20ies doing what you suggest, which is studying the heck out of these things. But it stops at engineering, where I try to be very open…

Would you even want to know if other people thought you read these situations incorrectly?

Re: “Autistic people can’t acknowledge when they’re wrong”

#198

Post by zamalek »

knaik94 wrote: post #187

I read this as writing from someone who has a hard time seeing from other people's perspective. I believe part of the responsibility falls on the author. While they acknowledge that they aren't great at communication, their conclusion does not include working on soft skills. It's something I realized when I started tutoring, if a student fails to understand you, it's not their fault for not understanding. It's on you…

> someone who has a hard time who has a hard time seeing from other people's perspective

You're blaming someone for their disability - this is basically the equivalent of blaming a paraplegic for not being able to walk. Social skills are almost entirely an intellectual process (as opposed to an instinctual process) for many autistic people. It's not like learning to ride a bike (as it is for neurotypical people), it's like learning algebra.

Here are some resources on accepting neurological differences, as opposed to trying to fix them: https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/basics/autism/neurodivers...

Re: “Autistic people can’t acknowledge when they’re wrong”

#199

Post by shlant »

starkd wrote: post #170
TimPC wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There isn’t anything “most” autistic people have. The disorder is defined by having at least three of twelve major symptoms so it’s possible for two people with autism to not even overlap in their symptoms. There is also a huge range of severity and many people with the disorder are high-functioning. High-functioning autism is significantly correlated with high IQs. This dismissal amounts to “this can’t be hard for y…

That's kind of my point. The traits that characterize the disorder are so varied, it's hard to believe its just one disorder. I think most people can identify with many of the symptons. I know I can, even though I'm not autistic. Personally, I think the economy seems to encourage that kind of productivity in many ways, so it shouldn't be such a mystery as to why some who are hyperfocused on succeeding should be ident…

> I dont think I was being dismissive of anyone

I think doubting someone is Autistic based on virtually no information would be considered pretty dismissive

Re: “Autistic people can’t acknowledge when they’re wrong”

#200

Post by pcthrowaway »

ebjaas_2022 wrote: post #195

Repost of an earlier comment I made, on a different thread: I think the difference is that an autistic person will see reality like this: | O O | | ----- ( inner landscape (fact) ) ----- | | | | | | / \ / \ | While the non-autistic person will see it like this: | O O | | ----- ( inner landscape (fact) ) ( inner landscape (fact) ) ----- | | | | | | / \ / \ | The non-autistic person will always assume that there are tw…

What makes you think autistic people are more inclined to have the first view, and the neurotypical people the latter?
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