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How fast is 12th Gen Intel Core?

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Re: How fast is 12th Gen Intel Core?

#251

Post by acdha »

KptMarchewa wrote: post #237
ant6n wrote: post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let’s remember AMD was absolute garbage for like 10 years until around 2016, when they finally bounced back. And they were getting closer and closer to bankruptcy, having to flog the silver - their fabs and even their campus. I’d say the Zen design and tsmc saved them (or Lisa Su and Keller). Intel is in a better position financially than AMD was, and could catch up again. I tend to think it depends a lot on the orga…

>Let’s remember AMD was absolute garbage for like 10 years until around 2016 After being ahead of Intel in the Pentium 4 era. The problem back then was marketing and giant amount of (probably illegal now) bundling that was rampant back then.

That last part is important. While Intel had good fab engineers, they also relied on cutthroat business deals requiring exclusivity to get discounts and promotional support and there were constant shenanigans with things like compiler support.

AMD had to make a much better product to get manufacturers to consider it, not just being price competitive. It took the P4 train wreck to get the market to shift but Intel had enough lock-in to make it to the Core generation without losing too much market share because so many of the vendors had those contracts.

Re: How fast is 12th Gen Intel Core?

#252

Post by washadjeffmad »

ant6n wrote: post #174
pedrocr wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The AMD offerings are much closer to M1 although they're not yet on TSMC 5nm so they don't quite match it. It's a historic event. Intel was #1 in laptops for an eternity. Even when the Pentium 4 was being outclassed by AMD Intel still kept the crown in mobile. This time around they first got overtaken by AMD and then by Apple and are now #3. Puts into perspective how huge of a miss their process node fail was.

Let’s remember AMD was absolute garbage for like 10 years until around 2016, when they finally bounced back. And they were getting closer and closer to bankruptcy, having to flog the silver - their fabs and even their campus. I’d say the Zen design and tsmc saved them (or Lisa Su and Keller). Intel is in a better position financially than AMD was, and could catch up again. I tend to think it depends a lot on the orga…

After running benchmarks on Intel and AMD CPUs from that era with mitigations, it's clear Intel never really had a performance lead due to design. That alone rewrites the entire "state of AMD" narrative.

If Intel only had a competitive advantage during that era because they traded performance for security, was there ever really an advantage?

I personally don't think Gelsinger is going to be able to fix their culture issues. He's been more intent on pumping stock and asking for handouts than innovating, which is part of what got them where they are in the first place, for good or ill.

Re: How fast is 12th Gen Intel Core?

#253

Post by alt227 »

sovnade wrote: post #244
alt227 wrote: post #239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>So I'm faced with having to log out and power off every day When did this become a chore? I do this as standard and imo all people should. SSD Boot times these days are mostly under a minute and you get a fresh desktop every time. EDIT: In fact I am one of the sysadmins which so many seem to despise on here. I have hybrid sleep and fast startup disabled by group policy on all my windows domain networks. It reduces s…

Because I have visual studio open, a solution loaded and organized with all the files I need for this sprint, SSMS with the servers all connected that I need, all my tabs open to see my jira board, support tickets, etc, a notepad doc i was using to take notes on a phone call, my ssh key loaded into pageant, and if my computer reboots, i'm going to forget half of that when it starts back up and lose 30+ minutes trying…

In our network there are no developers. That would be a different usecase which would require different policies. All tools required by staff are online and autosave everything. This in fact is another reason why proper restarts are enforced nightly, as most browsers with multiple tabs of heavy web apps start misbehaving very quickly. Forcing a nightly shutdown of browsers is an added bonus of proper shutdowns.

Be aware I am in a corporate environment, with all non technical users, and all services online.

Re: How fast is 12th Gen Intel Core?

#254

Post by Spooky23 »

newman314 wrote: post #198
sdoering wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree, but than you have corporate compliance installing an insane amount of Spyware on your device so that a 2021 XPS 13 Dell with a gen 10 Intel is out of battery when only using word within the hour. Fans spinning all the time and no way of disabling this madness. Nearly the same for my Mac colleagues. They maybe get 2 hours out of their M1 MBPs unplugged.

Recently discovered that Infosec has now mandated that all laptops have sleep disabled (the reason given is to be able to do endpoint patching). ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ So I'm faced with having to log out and power off every day or suck up the cost of keeping the laptop on. /r/maliciouscompliance, here I come I suppose. Tempted to get one of these: https://us.amazon.com/Vegamax-Button-Ethernet-Internet-Netwo...

Probably because with work at home there’s no WOL.

We disabled sleep to improve battery life and address a personal safety issue. There are many failure scenarios between various builds of Windows 10 and shitty drivers. Devices often wake up in bags and spin up fans until dead.

Normal scenario is that the battery is dead in the morning. In one case, it melted the compartment material in a bag and was deemed a safety hazard.

Re: How fast is 12th Gen Intel Core?

#255

Post by alt227 »

aeyes wrote: post #249
alt227 wrote: post #239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>So I'm faced with having to log out and power off every day When did this become a chore? I do this as standard and imo all people should. SSD Boot times these days are mostly under a minute and you get a fresh desktop every time. EDIT: In fact I am one of the sysadmins which so many seem to despise on here. I have hybrid sleep and fast startup disabled by group policy on all my windows domain networks. It reduces s…

> I have hybrid sleep and fast startup disabled by group policy I guess I'll have to add this to my questions to ask at job interviews. Admins like you these days sure try to make our lives as horrible as possible. Corporate anti-virus, DNS interception and policies like these turn my machine into something I constantly want to throw out the window. All because you are too lazy to ask a person to reboot if the machin…

Youve taken a lot of liberties and assumptions with my post here. I dont do any of those things you mentioned, only enforce a nightly shutdown.

Nothing to do with laziness. As other people have often mentioned on HN, in the real world of understaffed underbudget corporate IT you need to do what you can to enforce things which make everybodies life easier.

Re: How fast is 12th Gen Intel Core?

#256

Post by Spooky23 »

aeyes wrote: post #249
alt227 wrote: post #239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>So I'm faced with having to log out and power off every day When did this become a chore? I do this as standard and imo all people should. SSD Boot times these days are mostly under a minute and you get a fresh desktop every time. EDIT: In fact I am one of the sysadmins which so many seem to despise on here. I have hybrid sleep and fast startup disabled by group policy on all my windows domain networks. It reduces s…

> I have hybrid sleep and fast startup disabled by group policy I guess I'll have to add this to my questions to ask at job interviews. Admins like you these days sure try to make our lives as horrible as possible. Corporate anti-virus, DNS interception and policies like these turn my machine into something I constantly want to throw out the window. All because you are too lazy to ask a person to reboot if the machin…

Upthread you can see why. High drama developers will tell you that logging out will cost the company $25k a year because previous snowflake has to open notepad and disrupt their flow as they eat breakfast.

The frontline IT guys aren’t able to deal with shit like that, so a draconian policy comes top down.

Re: How fast is 12th Gen Intel Core?

#257

Post by kaliszad »

kcb wrote: post #18
nominusllc wrote: post #2

I went from saying, "if only they had an AMD" to getting a different machine in ARM and now im saying "if only they had ARM". I never realized how much heat, vibration, air blowers negatively affected me before. A framework laptop with some type of ARM or ARM-like cpu could do a lot with the space savings on cooling.

I've played with an AMD 6800u laptop and I would say it's the ideal x86 laptop chip right now. Normal usage at the 12w mode or light gaming at 20w mode was super impressive. Even though 12th Gen Intel chips have made great performance gains Intel is still relying on unsustainable high turbo boosts to get the benchmark numbers. I just recently stumbled across these two otherwise identical laptops. https://psref.lenovo…

At least on most ThinkPads, the AMD versions lack Thunderbolt 3/4/ USB 4.0 Full Feature (e.g. including TB) so if I have a Thunderbolt docking station, it will probably not work. Nobody confirmed to me, what would work in such a setting. Will Lenovo/ AMD provide USB 4 upgrade using firmware?

Of course, the next question is the potentially asymmetric RAM on the ThinkPads with one channel soldered and one SO-DIMM slot, e.g. the 48 GB version. Will it use dual-channel until ~32 GB and then single-channel? How will the GPU perform, e.g. will it use only one slot in such a configuration. So many questions...

Re: How fast is 12th Gen Intel Core?

#258

Post by f1refly »

vladvasiliu wrote: post #242
lhl wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The HP EliteBooks (and the new Dev One Linux variant) also have trackpoints. Just in case anyone's interested in making their own though, I've seen a few DIY trackpoint projects over the years (mostly on custom mechs, not laptop keyboards though). Here's a writeup on one: https://edryd.org/posts/tp-mk/

> The HP EliteBooks (and the new Dev One Linux variant) also have trackpoints. Are those supposed to be any good? I have an EB Gen8 with one, but I find it horrendous. I'd like to know whether it's because I have no idea how to use it, or if my Linux setup is broken, or if the hardware is actually shitty.

I had a company provided 2019 dell at my last job and the trackpoint was barely comparable to that of a 2011 thinkpad. If that's the only trackpoint experience is that some people get I understand why they'd never touch one again.

Re: How fast is 12th Gen Intel Core?

#259

Post by tfigment »

brailsafe wrote: post #200
antihero wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How much corporate garbage on it, though?

Out of curiosity, and aside from Teams which I'm already sadly familiar with, what software is it that you're talking about? Company I work for was just bought by some megacorp, but I'm still using my own 2019 13" MBP for now.

My company has some McAfee and Palo Alto stuff and the cyvera cloud backup software which scans every file every 4 hours but then triggers the other software because of access attempts. Some of these are suites so its 3-4 diferent things (firewall, dlp, antivirus, ...)

Re: How fast is 12th Gen Intel Core?

#260

Post by nicolaslem »

ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #240
nicolaslem wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have been using a 6800U on Linux for the past two weeks. With kernel 5.18 almost everything is supported out of the box. The few issues I have: - Kernel logs show that the GPU driver crashes from time to time. When it happens the screen freezes for a few seconds but recovers. - HVEC hardware decoder gives green artifacts on VLC using VA-API. - It seems not to support advanced power management, on battery the CPU wi…

Can I ask which laptop that is?

Sure, HP 845 G9.
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