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TikTok’s Poison Pill

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Re: TikTok’s Poison Pill

#231
post #153

TikTok makes me incredibly angry and I need to vent about it somewhere so I am going to vent about it here. I have ADHD. TikTok is almost certainly designed in a way to directly exploit that fact. It really makes me angry. It feels like they are making a real attempt to take my agency away and to create a product that triggers me so viscerally that I can't keep away from it. I feel like I am intentionally being taken…

the Chinese actually call it "spiritual opium". the CCP probably see it as some sort of poetic revenge for the real opium trade and the ensuing Sino-British war that they see as the start of the "century of humiliation"

They also manufacture most of the precursors for fentanyl, so it's not like the poetic revenge stops at TikTok.

Re: TikTok’s Poison Pill

#232
post #153

TikTok makes me incredibly angry and I need to vent about it somewhere so I am going to vent about it here. I have ADHD. TikTok is almost certainly designed in a way to directly exploit that fact. It really makes me angry. It feels like they are making a real attempt to take my agency away and to create a product that triggers me so viscerally that I can't keep away from it. I feel like I am intentionally being taken…

It's just a video app, exercise some self-discipline and self-accountability and uninstall the app.

I don't use TikTok but even in my mid 40s fell victim to Instagram reels. What's astonishing to me is that I have a level of self control that's way more than the average individual (for instance I have taken cold showers for ever).Even with such an otherwise resilience I fell victim to Instagram reels and their infinite supply of mindless entertainment. It took a week for me to unshackle and get rid of this imbecile nonsense. I still have the app on my phone but am actively not opening it. My hypothesis is that if you can do this for a continued duration, then the existence of the app won't bother you. You can't go around deleting everything from your life. You lead your life on your terms, despite the distractions.

So the addictive forces are quite powerful and for the average individual, it's really hard to get out of this addiction.

Re: TikTok’s Poison Pill

#233
post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's just a video app, exercise some self-discipline and self-accountability and uninstall the app.

Great if you're able to do that easily. Please understand that some of the most brilliant minds in the world get up in the morning usually somewhere in California, and work many hours in the day, and their literal job is to figure out how to subvert this.

Unfortunately regulations will always be one step behind. Asking for them is victim mentality. We’re responsible for our own choices.

Everyone might get addicted to TikTok for some period. But everyone needn’t stay addicted to TikTok. (Of course I use “TikTok” as a placeholder for any infinitely consumable feed of targeted content.)

Regulation has a place. For example, an obvious and easy win would be to pass a bill requiring any product with a consumable feed to offer and default to an option to sort it in reverse chronological order.

But regulation is a reactive and slow strategy to shrinking a problem that continues to metastasize. There are more proactive social strategies available to us. Education is free. Self-control is free. Unfortunately, they’re only “free” modulo the minutes of attention we can allocate to them from our finite lifetime supply.

I wonder, how many minutes of education or self-introspection is required to prevent one future minute of app usage? I’m optimistic this ratio is favorable, so that once people sufficiently internalize the effect of infinite consumable feeds, they will naturally reduce their self-sabotaging usage of them.

People will adapt. It will just take a while. Sometimes you gotta get burned to learn not to touch the stove. In the meantime, we could require the products to provide resources and tools to reduce addiction (like HN’s noprocrast). And we should also find a way to blunt the impact of social media on those who have not yet begun their journey with its addiction (like children, or people yet to be born into our satirical dystopia of a society). If kids are glamorizing social media before they are old enough to use it, they will not have an easy experience separating themselves from it later in life.

Cigarette smoking rates are way down since twenty years ago when we started convincing children it was gross and uncool. We can do that with social media too.

Re: TikTok’s Poison Pill

#234
post #204
post #184

Broadly, it's fascinating that I think we've definitively moved out of the age of "social media theory" (what might this new form of media do) into "experimentation and iteration" (in which we are absolutely the guinea pigs, but at least for now we mostly know it?") TikTok is especially a wildly mixed bag for me. I fully acknowledge that its manipulation of attention is disgusting and the data it holds is wildly dang…

This is the real reason behind the FUD in my opinion. Despite all these articles presenting TikTok content as vapid and mindless time wasting, in my experience it's been the opposite. TikTok is full of authentic policial commentary, anti-racist education, historical analysis, and anti-capitalist content. It's doing a lot to give people a voice who otherwise haven't been well-represented on other platforms. It's a big…

Yeah, sure.

The entire world revolves around the American Race Problem. As it always does from inside your bubble.

Re: TikTok’s Poison Pill

#236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps the real culprits are the digital "gas stations" that make money hand-over-fist with TikTok's engagement loop. Apple, Google, and to an extent, Microsoft are all complicit in letting people make addictive experiences that promote their respective platforms. Much like the gas station, the smartphone is ubiquitous. Everyone passes by the TikTok aisle on their way to texting their mom or Googling a pie recipe, r…

I was just having a chat with my buddy today about how Apple, Microsoft and to a large extent Google are largely the best positioned to profit from any upstream applications. While the likes of Facebook, Instagram and TikTok fight for viewership, these underlying platforms are just counting profits regardless of who reigns supreme on the top. I don't know if Jobs saw this future unfold but here it is. The gas station…

If it's any consolation, I'm equally comfortable cussing out Henry Ford as opposed to Steve Jobs.

Re: TikTok’s Poison Pill

#237

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As an ex-smoker, I never felt any anger towards cigarette companies. Only anger I felt was towards government regulations like banning smoking indoors or high taxes on cigarettes. Also felt a bit annoyed with society judging the smokers. Even when I was trying to quit, I didn't blame cigarette companies. Now in retrospect, I am glad that those regulations, taxes, and judgmental stares slowly nudged me towards quittin…

>As an ex-smoker, I never felt any anger towards cigarette companies. Only anger I felt was towards government regulations like banning smoking indoors or high taxes on cigarettes. Also felt a bit annoyed with society judging the smokers. Even when I was trying to quit, I didn't blame cigarette companies. If the majority of this cultural change happened during the age of the internet and the leaked info from manufact…

Better or worse? The cigarette companies would've loved the era of "fake news".

Re: TikTok’s Poison Pill

#238
post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've not been diagnosed with ADHD, though have some symptoms (though honestly, some of those are just standard "human living in 2022"), but I do know I have what I would consider an "addictive personality". I can't answer how gambling addicts or smokers feel, but I will share a similar experience - I had to uninstall Candy Crush Saga from my phone, because I would literally open it, and then "come to" ~40 minutes lat…

I read a book called "the power of habits" a few years back and there was a few chapters focusing on the gamification and how our brains tend to develop habits (and in some case addiction). Ever since reading this book, I've noticed patterns in the way apps are developed. Candy crush and other similar game apps are a bit obvious, but for me the most sticking one for me is the facebook app. They introduced a few years…

I remember when acquaintances at Facebook first saw all of the psychological stuff Candy Crush was doing and how distraught they were about it. So sad that they chose to emulate what they knew was horrible behavior.

Re: TikTok’s Poison Pill

#239
post #153

TikTok makes me incredibly angry and I need to vent about it somewhere so I am going to vent about it here. I have ADHD. TikTok is almost certainly designed in a way to directly exploit that fact. It really makes me angry. It feels like they are making a real attempt to take my agency away and to create a product that triggers me so viscerally that I can't keep away from it. I feel like I am intentionally being taken…

It's just a video app, exercise some self-discipline and self-accountability and uninstall the app.

Yes and no. I mean, you are correct in a very abstract way, but there is something to be said for an industry that is able to manipulate a large swath of the population by exploiting various human predilections. Saying it is just self-discipline and accountability is limiting the conversation to a frame that benefits those companies without looking at the totality of the reasons behind it.

Re: TikTok’s Poison Pill

#240
post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the real reason behind the FUD in my opinion. Despite all these articles presenting TikTok content as vapid and mindless time wasting, in my experience it's been the opposite. TikTok is full of authentic policial commentary, anti-racist education, historical analysis, and anti-capitalist content. It's doing a lot to give people a voice who otherwise haven't been well-represented on other platforms. It's a big…

Yeah, sure. The entire world revolves around the American Race Problem. As it always does from inside your bubble.

I can only speak from my bubble, fair enough, but I almost never see this aspect explored in reporting on Tiktok. The articles always focus on the algorithm, never the actual content and community.

Evidently something is quite different from Reddit and Twitter since those platforms have about a quarter to a half of the MAU of TikTok despite being around much longer. "Algorithm" is a hand-wavey explanation. No amount of algorithmic content selection can keep me engaged when the content itself is of lower quality.

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