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Disneyland with Death Penalty

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Re: Disneyland with Death Penalty

#131

Post by googlryas »

solveit wrote: post #53
googlryas wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe my example was poorly done, but I think it shares the same reasoning flaw that OP had in the original - the belief that a very strong denial is somehow evidence of guilt. I saw similar logic in a COVID thread recently, with someone saying essentially that the lab leak theory must be true, because China is denying it so hard. Well, that's what innocent people do too when they're wrongly accused of something.

Banning the publication of media when accused of illiberalism is in fact evidence of illiberalism.

The article did much more than accuse them of illiberalism. It isn't clear which claim lead to the article being banned...or even that it was banned (I assume it was, but I can't find a copy of the source, and the source is a wired article ostensibly about Negroponte). I actually probably have the Mar 1995 Wired at my parents house on my book shelf, but unfortunately that is 3000 miles away.

Re: Disneyland with Death Penalty

#132

Post by brnt »

bnralt wrote: post #82

I personally found Singapore charming when I was there. It's a fascinating mix of several different cultures who all seem to retained many of their traditional customs. I never understood the sterile critique myself, the city never struck me as such. Gibson's main critique, from what I can tell, is the lack of much of a counterculture similar to what you'd find in the U.S. allied-bloc (Europe, U.S., Canada, Japan, So…

Singapore's repression isn't exactly a secret, and if freedom is not a purpose to use your wealth for, then I don't see the point of wealth.

Counterculture is healthy and natural for many reasons, and its absence is a concerning indicator for any nation.

Re: Disneyland with Death Penalty

#133

Post by antod »

oxfeed65261 wrote: post #2

The 1993 Wired article, by William Gibson: https://www.wired.com/1993/04/gibson-2/ or https://archive.ph/twY5Y

That issue was my first intro to Wired when I spotted it on a coffee table and was intrigued by the Disneyland line. It was probably another year after that before I actually used the internet - after reading a few Wired magazines, I wasn't really sure what to expect...

Re: Disneyland with Death Penalty

#134

Post by googlryas »

function_seven wrote: post #115
googlryas wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe my example was poorly done, but I think it shares the same reasoning flaw that OP had in the original - the belief that a very strong denial is somehow evidence of guilt. I saw similar logic in a COVID thread recently, with someone saying essentially that the lab leak theory must be true, because China is denying it so hard. Well, that's what innocent people do too when they're wrongly accused of something.

> the belief that a very strong denial is somehow evidence of guilt. That's not the evidence of guilt. They can deny it as often and as strongly as they want. When they instead ban the article in their country, then it's doing the thing they deny they do.

When did Singapore claim they don't censor media? There is an entire agency (IMDA) devoted to censoring media, and it isn't some kind of covert operation.

Re: Disneyland with Death Penalty

#136

Post by rr888 »

pydry wrote: post #16
causi wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Kind of depends. It's more sterile. Dubai you get the impression they generally care about you having a good time, at least if you're Western. Singapore they care about you looking like you're having a good time. Singapore doesn't have the de facto slavery problem of the Emirates, though. Food is definitely better in Dubai.

>Singapore doesn't have the de facto slavery problem of the Emirates It kind of does. They import Bangladeshi construction workers to build all the glitzy skyscrapers and infrastructure and shove them in dorms 16 to a room. Im not sure if they confiscate their passports or not like in Dubai but i think they still do those contracts where they have to pay an agent and work off their debts. A fair number die because of…

Kinda weird to see maid salaries ranked by race https://transfermaids.com/blogs/maid-salary-singapore. Myanmar maids should have at least 1 day off per month.

Re: Disneyland with Death Penalty

#137

Post by deltree7 »

bnralt wrote: post #82

I personally found Singapore charming when I was there. It's a fascinating mix of several different cultures who all seem to retained many of their traditional customs. I never understood the sterile critique myself, the city never struck me as such. Gibson's main critique, from what I can tell, is the lack of much of a counterculture similar to what you'd find in the U.S. allied-bloc (Europe, U.S., Canada, Japan, So…

Singapore's criticism will always come from 'White Educated Liberals'.

If you are earning a comfortable 6 figure salary in a developed nation, living in an extremely safe neighborhood with access to great education and healthcare, you kind assume all those things are easy and the only thing that matters is food/music diversity and counter-culture.

For the rest of 7,950,000,000 people on earth, any country that provides safety, basic food, health, decent education is a heaven and wouldn't mind if their own country is like Singapore

Re: Disneyland with Death Penalty

#138

Post by sigstoat »

notahacker wrote: post #89
sigstoat wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the declaration of independence is ~1300 words. a half-assed attempt at counting the words in the article (minus of the copy of the declaration that it contains) comes up with about ~10900 words. is that strange? what ratio isn't strange?

tbf the Declaration of Independence was a nation-defining historical event, a collaboration involving a lot of people, and text which has shaped a couple of centuries of American law. Disneyland with the Death Penalty is a pretty self-explanatory magazine article which has somehow ended up with a more detailed summary than many of Gibson's novels. Only on Wikipedia would that sort of prioritisation be normal.

> Only on Wikipedia would that sort of prioritisation be normal.

perhaps if you addressed your concerns to their prioritization committee, you could effect some change.

Re: Disneyland with Death Penalty

#139

Post by sib »

pydry wrote: post #56
rayiner wrote: post #27

As someone from Bangladesh, I read this and think "who cares?" In 1960 Singapore was a poor third world country. Today it's as rich as the US. You cannot understand how significant such a change is to the people of the country unless you've lived in a third world country and really seen what it's like. Whatever draconian measures it took to get there, they were worth it. Fareed Zakaria's interview with Lee Kuan Yew,…

The key features that made it fantastically rich were sitting on one of the world's most strategically located ports, building a lot of soviet style housing and a leader with nowhere to run. Being a city state means it's hard to hide when things get ugly. Having capitals far away from citizenry, on the other hand - like in myanmar or brazil, makes it easy to be corrupt. This is a well studied phenomenon. Lee Kuan Yew…

1950's America also benefited from having created the biggest wartime production economy the world had ever seen, combined with most other "advanced" economies having been turned to rubble. At the end of WWII, the US's GDP was greater than the rest of the world combined.

Re: Disneyland with Death Penalty

#140

Post by deltree7 »

brnt wrote: post #132
bnralt wrote: post #82

I personally found Singapore charming when I was there. It's a fascinating mix of several different cultures who all seem to retained many of their traditional customs. I never understood the sterile critique myself, the city never struck me as such. Gibson's main critique, from what I can tell, is the lack of much of a counterculture similar to what you'd find in the U.S. allied-bloc (Europe, U.S., Canada, Japan, So…

Singapore's repression isn't exactly a secret, and if freedom is not a purpose to use your wealth for, then I don't see the point of wealth. Counterculture is healthy and natural for many reasons, and its absence is a concerning indicator for any nation.

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