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PragDave: I'm on vacation, and I've deleted your message—really

pragdave.blogs.pragprog.com

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Re: PragDave: I'm on vacation, and I've deleted your message—really

#41

Post by JoeAltmaier »

Legion wrote: post #9

Interesting idea, but I highly dislike it. The entire point of email is that it is the "leave a message and I'll get back to you" mode of communication for the Internet. It is not the "respond right now" mode - that is what IM and chat rooms and other real-time communications are. I have things to do too, you know, and keeping track of someone else's schedule in order to be able to send them an email isn't on the lis…

Its actually my human right to 'force' other people to communicate on my schedule. Our own time is actually all any of us have.

You are free to decide if your gem of wisdom is important enough to actually notice if I get it, or just fling it into the ether. Your call.

Re: PragDave: I'm on vacation, and I've deleted your message—really

#42

Post by synnik »

This has been tried before and discussed before.

The problem with it is that it sends a message that, "I am more important than you, and nothing you say can possibly be important enough to be worth keeping."

Now, maybe that is even true. But slapping people in the face with it isn't a good habit.

Re: PragDave: I'm on vacation, and I've deleted your message—really

#43

Post by JoeAltmaier »

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #41
Legion wrote: post #9

Interesting idea, but I highly dislike it. The entire point of email is that it is the "leave a message and I'll get back to you" mode of communication for the Internet. It is not the "respond right now" mode - that is what IM and chat rooms and other real-time communications are. I have things to do too, you know, and keeping track of someone else's schedule in order to be able to send them an email isn't on the lis…

Its actually my human right to 'force' other people to communicate on my schedule. Our own time is actually all any of us have. You are free to decide if your gem of wisdom is important enough to actually notice if I get it, or just fling it into the ether. Your call.

And by the way, I'm not going to read any replies to this post. Just letting you know.

Re: PragDave: I'm on vacation, and I've deleted your message—really

#44

Post by losvedir »

Legion wrote: post #9

Interesting idea, but I highly dislike it. The entire point of email is that it is the "leave a message and I'll get back to you" mode of communication for the Internet. It is not the "respond right now" mode - that is what IM and chat rooms and other real-time communications are. I have things to do too, you know, and keeping track of someone else's schedule in order to be able to send them an email isn't on the lis…

It's to help manage all the emails when he returns, only some of which will still be relevant at that point.

Consider the case where Dave's response causes the sender to realize, "Oh, well, I'll take care of the issue this other way then."

That's one fewer email Dave will have to deal with when he returns. The traditional out-of-office strategy would result in the initial email, and possibly even a second "Oh, don't worry about it, I already took care of it." followup email.

Re: PragDave: I'm on vacation, and I've deleted your message—really

#45

Post by xonev »

hollerith wrote: post #38
DanielBMarkham wrote: post #31

In the late 1990s I worked for a large government agency as part of a job that employed over 1200 contractors (Welcome to government work.) Each day I'd get incredible amounts of email -- most of which was completely useless to me. Before I left, I asked if I could form a small team and take part in a 2-3 month project. They had initially planned on a team of 20, but I felt that small teams, left alone and working in…

>Hell, by the time you've switched context, you might as well read the article: your concentration is shot. Ten seconds of scanning an email header might take five or ten minutes to recover from. I read email only once or twice a day and have turned off all email notifications, which eliminates this objection to email. Footnote: "turned off all email notifications": exception: I set procmail to play some music whenev…

Oh man - I'd love to see how she'd react to the knowledge that she is being conditioned.

Re: PragDave: I'm on vacation, and I've deleted your message—really

#46

Post by raganwald »

The passive-agressive way to do this is to have an auto-response saying you cannot read the email and giving options for resolving issues while you're away. And when you get back, send everyone an email declaring inbox bankruptcy.

People respond positively when they get an email saying "I returned from paternity leave to 1,532 emails and I'm worroed I may miss something important from you. If the matter you raised while I was away still needs attention, please resend it to me now."

Re: PragDave: I'm on vacation, and I've deleted your message—really

#47

Post by damoncali »

MatthewPhillips wrote: post #40
DanielBMarkham wrote: post #31

In the late 1990s I worked for a large government agency as part of a job that employed over 1200 contractors (Welcome to government work.) Each day I'd get incredible amounts of email -- most of which was completely useless to me. Before I left, I asked if I could form a small team and take part in a 2-3 month project. They had initially planned on a team of 20, but I felt that small teams, left alone and working in…

You didn't find it distracting when people walked to your cube to talk? Or was this a very infrequent occurrence (and/or only by team-members, not the business)?

I worked in a similar environment once (Large government contractor on a NASA program). There was lots of cube-walking, and generally, it is a distraction. BUT- You know that when you walk into someone's cube to ask them a question, it will be a bit of a distraction and it takes a little effort, so you make sure you need to before you do. Similarly, when someone walks into your cube, you know they think it is more important than something that would have been sent via email.

Not that it works perfectly, but the default of dumping everything into email is a problem. There are several other, possibly more appropriate methods of communication (phone, in person, waiting until the status meeting, break room chat, lunchtime chat, etc). Email is just the easiest and therefore most likely to be abused.

Re: PragDave: I'm on vacation, and I've deleted your message—really

#48

Post by damoncali »

officemonkey wrote: post #35
csallen wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> It significantly reduces the workload for Dave but increases the workload for others. Yes, but that's to be expected. If you're a very popular person, people should have to compete for your time. That's marginally inconvenient for them, yes, but it makes your life livable. It's like important CEOs having a secretary.

> It's like important CEOs having a secretary. I've never understood why busy people don't use staff to "pre-clean" the inbox. Especially if you get dozens of emails a day. After a vacation (heck, every day), I spend a lot of time deleting spam, daily reports, and threads I'm cc'd in (but get resolved by others).

Tom Osborne (the legendary Nebraska football coach and now athletic director for those who don't watch college football) does this. In fact, he sends and receives his email through an assistant, at least when dealing with the public. Still personal, but I imagine it helps him stay sane.

Re: PragDave: I'm on vacation, and I've deleted your message—really

#49

Post by damoncali »

synnik wrote: post #42

This has been tried before and discussed before. The problem with it is that it sends a message that, "I am more important than you, and nothing you say can possibly be important enough to be worth keeping." Now, maybe that is even true. But slapping people in the face with it isn't a good habit.

That depends on the wording. What if it said "I'm on vacation, and when I get back, your email will be one of several hundred that have piled up (I get a lot of email). If this is a really important message, please send it again to me later, when I'm back at work. If you don't there is a good chance I won't get to it for a long time."?

Re: PragDave: I'm on vacation, and I've deleted your message—really

#50

Post by MatthewPhillips »

damoncali wrote: post #47
MatthewPhillips wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You didn't find it distracting when people walked to your cube to talk? Or was this a very infrequent occurrence (and/or only by team-members, not the business)?

I worked in a similar environment once (Large government contractor on a NASA program). There was lots of cube-walking, and generally, it is a distraction. BUT- You know that when you walk into someone's cube to ask them a question, it will be a bit of a distraction and it takes a little effort, so you make sure you need to before you do. Similarly, when someone walks into your cube, you know they think it is more im…

I think that works with other developers who understands how interrupting someone in the middle of coding is a big deal, but I've worked with PMs and QA people who didn't get the message that asking 4 or 5 questions a day is not cool.

Personally I prefer email for this reason. Too often I've seen coworkers who become "the guy who helps". The guy doesn't say no, who answers questions that have nothing to do with their job. I like to be helpful but I don't want to be the one who fixes everyone else's problems to the detriment of getting my own work done. It's easier to say "you should ask Joe, he's in charge of that process" in an email, for me anyways.

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