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A Mormon housewife turned a fake diary into an enormous best-seller

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Re: A Mormon housewife turned a fake diary into an enormous best-seller

#81

Post by rayiner »

ck2 wrote: post #43
rayiner wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> even worse suppressing women and minorities Christianity and faith that everyone was created equal in the eyes of God was essential to inventing the concept of racial equality at a time when science couldn’t prove that assertion. Put yourself in 1850–looking around at societies in the world as they existed then—and make a scientific case for racial equality powerful enough to convince hundreds of thousands of free…

Quoted post unavailable.

> Are you kidding me? You realize slavery, torture and beatings was justified based on the bible alone

This isn’t a historically correct statement. Slavery has existed in myriad societies that don’t read the Bible. In Civil War era America, the Confederates sought to place themselves on the side of “science” and characterized the union as religious “zealots.” https://www.battlefields.org/learn/primary-sources/cornersto...

What’s remarkable about Christian societies is that they ended slavery the way they did. To my knowledge there’s no other example of a society that tore itself apart and where people sacrificed by hundreds of thousands of their own for the freedom of a different group of people.

Re: A Mormon housewife turned a fake diary into an enormous best-seller

#82

Post by bambax »

bertil wrote: post #80
bambax wrote: post #51

This is the end of TFA: > Emerson sees Sparks chiefly as an impostor, but she comes across as a true believer, both in evil and in her capacity to combat it by scaring teen-agers straight. Imposter vs. True Believer: evil schemer or naive righteous soccer mom... Mmm... Or maybe she was... an artist?! I find it quite shocking and incredible that still today, she's casually dismissed as a fabricator. Every fiction is a…

Art would be doing something like the Blair Witch Project , that is trying to maintain the credibility of the fiction but still has a producer listed on IMDb. This is a bad lie.

I put this in a response to a comment that became dead, so I'm reproducing it here:

Fargo was presented as a "true story", which it wasn't. Yet nobody ever dismissed the Coen brothers as "fabricators".

My theory is that in art, as in most things, you're either "in" or "out". If you're in, you can do anything with impunity. If you're out, your every actions will be scrutinized and you will be forgiven nothing.

This whole article smells of virtue signalling, and I have an issue with that.

Re: A Mormon housewife turned a fake diary into an enormous best-seller

#83

Post by pseudo0 »

ciphol wrote: post #72
tomrod wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Likewise. All negative or positive aspects of the religion aside, the geographical aspect to Mormon congregations build affinity networks quickly. This is both an asset (it can integrate you into a community quickly) while also being a liability (more MLM and Ponzi schemes). I learned this weekend this geographic designation for local congregations is shared among the Amish, where congregation (to my understanding an…

Do the Amish, or Hasidic Jews or whoever, have lots of MLMs and Ponzi schemes?

Bernie Madoff is the classic example, his affinity fraud targeted wealthy Jewish individuals, foundations, and charities. In terms of relative frequency though, good question. Utah is an oddity where state-level stats are a decent estimate for Mormons, given the 70% membership. It would be harder to get equivalent stats for Jewish or Amish communities.

Re: A Mormon housewife turned a fake diary into an enormous best-seller

#84

Post by przemub »

pyuser583 wrote: post #60
lmm wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A relatively close-knit, high-trust society, with a lot of housewives eager to make themselves some money in a socially acceptable way?

You’re describing Japan. Does Japan have pyramid schemes and MLM? I just watched the anime “Welcome to NHK” and there was an MLM subplot.

Yeah, it happens in Japan. Even more dangerous are new religious groups - like the Unification Church you'd probably heard about due to Abe's asassination.

Re: A Mormon housewife turned a fake diary into an enormous best-seller

#85

Post by supportlocal4h »

bloomingeek wrote: post #74
supportlocal4h wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I sympathize a lot with the moms you characterize as "wanting to make an easy buck." How do you put in 8 hours a day as an accountant or hair stylist or fire fighter or HR rep between morning snack, potty training, reading time, nap time, outside play time, music time, etc.? Maybe you try to get paid for raising your own kids by daycaring other kids at the same time. Is that also an easy buck? Not everybody has a k8s…

So what if a housewife/family refuse to purchase any product another housewife/family is pushing? Is there any rejection of said family? Is the whole family networking system based solely on sales? Is it considered not cooperating, from a religious stand point, not to purchase these products? Will church status be effected if purchases aren't made and a family punished?

This is a fair question from somebody who has never seen it in action. The answer, from my experience, is no. Regarding the religious or church status matter, absolutely no. The church isn't pushing these things and even cautions about them.

Socially? A person might feel obligated to help a friend, same as any other culture. Then again, if you're just as cash strapped, ... It's really a personal decision. Just like buying Girl Scout cookies. Or the open guitar case next to the street performer. Plenty of people refuse to respond to invites to an MLM "party." Some people avoid yard sales. But it shouldn't affect friendships.

Re: A Mormon housewife turned a fake diary into an enormous best-seller

#86

Post by hnbad »

teddyh wrote: post #68
sva_ wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

Antisemitism is a serious accusation. What is your proof?

You already know the answer, but it's well-established consensus among historians that the Anne Frank diary is authentic: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Diary_of_a_Young_Girl#Auth...

The conspiracy theory that it is fabricated is mostly pushed by fringe "historical revisionists" engaging in Holocaust denial. There are some Christian fundamentalists in the US who also peddle this narrative because the original unedited diary contains segments describing Anne Frank (a girl) feeling physical and romantic attraction towards other girls -- despite the glaring issue with this narrative being that her estate initially removed these sections from the published versions because they were uncomfortable with them.

You don't need to play these games here. Pretending you're "just asking questions" to hide your political alignment is not working as well as you think and not nearly as clever as it makes you feel.

Re: A Mormon housewife turned a fake diary into an enormous best-seller

#87

Post by mrcheesebreeze »

bambax wrote: post #51

This is the end of TFA: > Emerson sees Sparks chiefly as an impostor, but she comes across as a true believer, both in evil and in her capacity to combat it by scaring teen-agers straight. Imposter vs. True Believer: evil schemer or naive righteous soccer mom... Mmm... Or maybe she was... an artist?! I find it quite shocking and incredible that still today, she's casually dismissed as a fabricator. Every fiction is a…

because there are double standards for certain groups.

Nowadays if you are religious or conservatives you are a bigot nazi and should be demonized always.

This isn't one sided though, conservatives demonize liberals as terrorist commies, its just that the media companies push the first narrative more often.

When we realize its all hogwash, and that news companies are owned by a few companies to promote culture wars.

At the end of the day its a side effect of media radicalization to allow the corrupt to further rob the middle and low classes of what little they have left.

a chart from 2019 I believe, could be more or less recent: https://i0.wp.com/swprs.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/cfr-m...

Re: A Mormon housewife turned a fake diary into an enormous best-seller

#88

Post by bdavisx »

WheelsAtLarge wrote: post #40
Enydosnes wrote: post #29

Very interesting article and it's worth considering how even though we can easily recognise these stories as being laughably fake these days, it's worth keeping in mind that fearmongering stories like this continue to be peddled to people with certain prejudices, and the only thing that's really changed since then is its shape and approach

Be careful with dismissing the general idea that drugs can lead to a miserable life since drugs can lead to complete misery. I was going down the street at my downtown the other day. I looked to the side, the side of the sidewalk, and saw someone that had lost all control of his life and was barely hanging on. He was sticking a needle in his arm and was shooting up. He looked like life had chewed him up and spit him…

>It was shocking to see it. It's very sad that addiction can lead to such circumstances.

Perhaps circumstances lead to the drugs, how do you know that person's actual story?

Re: A Mormon housewife turned a fake diary into an enormous best-seller

#89

Post by dhosek »

wanderingstan wrote: post #47
sn41 wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just a tangential request: is there any curated playlist consisting of such good podcasts? I have a difficult time discovering interesting podcasts. (Maybe that's an interesting project)

Years ago I had a rough but working prototype where people could submit individual podcast episodes that would then get assembled into a “best of“ feed. Now that podcasts have taken off, maybe it’s time to dust that project off!

I’d thought of doing something like that myself ages ago. I had conceived of a curated feed that would alternate a brief introductory episode saying what was cool about what’s next in the feed and then the episode (served off the original podcast’s URL).

Re: A Mormon housewife turned a fake diary into an enormous best-seller

#90

Post by heywoodlh »

moistly wrote: post #62
heywoodlh wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, I served my mission in California and I can say there aren't many topics that make strangers more uncomfortable than religion. At the end of the day, though, I found most people (whether or not they were interested in religion) care about being happy and having purpose and it was/is enjoyable to observe common ground with other humans in that realm. That being said, lots of people get pissed about religion bein…

Quoted post unavailable.

This sounds like it is backed by some negative experiences with religious folk. I'd be interested to hear what you have experienced if you are willing to share?
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