Tim O'Reilly: I am really starting to hate Mac OS X. • Hacker News Board

Re: Tim O'Reilly: I am really starting to hate Mac OS X.

#351

Post by highwind81 » Sun, Nov 13, 2011, 4:38 AM UTC

quanticle wrote: post #346

sjs wrote: post #278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you asked a friend or searched Google instead of writing your problems here perhaps you would have found the solutions. You took time to learn how to use Linux and the shell, why not take some time to learn how to use OS X as well before complaining that it doesn't do what you want? It does do most of the things you mentioned, and when it doesn't it's by design. Resizing from any side: Legitimate complaint. Fixed…

>Your expectations don't make it broken. It's not 1990 anymore. All operating systems manufacturers need to understand that the vast majority of users have used Windows and are used to Windows' UI conventions. At the very least, one should offer a way for the Windows user to discover what the new conventions are, rather than having to Google and find websites that other people have made when they made the same transi…

> All operating systems manufacturers need to understand that the vast majority of users have used Windows and are used to Windows' UI conventions.

That sounds like the worst way to innovate. I'm not saying that Apple's way is innovative but I say we are all better off if OS manufacturers try difference things to come up with better way of presenting UI.

For example, if apple followed the Window's way of displaying every single window in its Dock, then application based taskbar in Windows 7 would have never come about.

Trying different things should never be criticized for just being different. If that different way of doing things is bad, criticize it but don't point finger just because it's different.

Re: Tim O'Reilly: I am really starting to hate Mac OS X.

#352

Post by sounds » Sun, Nov 13, 2011, 4:44 AM UTC

watmough wrote: post #105

fauigerzigerk wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A lot of people (including me) are suffering from dropped wifi connections. There's a thread on the Apple support forums that has 1264 replies and 157731 views: https://discussions.apple.com/thread/3191630?start=0&tst... Apple has been trying to fix it ever since Lion came out. After 2 updates it's still not working for me.

I fixed my WiFi not reconnecting by zapping my PRAM. Cmd-Opt-P-R on boot and hold down until you get a couple of loud bongs. Yeah! I know! First time doing that has ever fixed a damn thing for me, but not reconnecting to my WiFi was starting to become an annoyance. This was on a new main logic board on my 2007 MBP running a fresh install of Lion 10.7.2 copied out of the Install app and burned to an 8GB USB key.

Switched to a Broadcom chip and still can't resolve all the silicon-level bugs. http://wiki.debian.org/MacBook

Broadcom may make Tim Cook happier, but Atheros is more the "Steve" of wifi chips. However, the 2007 MBP uses Atheros - yours is actually a different issue.

Re: Tim O'Reilly: I am really starting to hate Mac OS X.

#353

Post by sjs » Sun, Nov 13, 2011, 4:55 AM UTC

quanticle wrote: post #346

sjs wrote: post #278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you asked a friend or searched Google instead of writing your problems here perhaps you would have found the solutions. You took time to learn how to use Linux and the shell, why not take some time to learn how to use OS X as well before complaining that it doesn't do what you want? It does do most of the things you mentioned, and when it doesn't it's by design. Resizing from any side: Legitimate complaint. Fixed…

>Your expectations don't make it broken. It's not 1990 anymore. All operating systems manufacturers need to understand that the vast majority of users have used Windows and are used to Windows' UI conventions. At the very least, one should offer a way for the Windows user to discover what the new conventions are, rather than having to Google and find websites that other people have made when they made the same transi…

> It's not 1990 anymore.

All the more reason not to have a maximize button. Displays only get more pixels year to year.

Re: Tim O'Reilly: I am really starting to hate Mac OS X.

#354

Post by extempore » Sun, Nov 13, 2011, 5:01 AM UTC

quanticle wrote: post #346

sjs wrote: post #278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you asked a friend or searched Google instead of writing your problems here perhaps you would have found the solutions. You took time to learn how to use Linux and the shell, why not take some time to learn how to use OS X as well before complaining that it doesn't do what you want? It does do most of the things you mentioned, and when it doesn't it's by design. Resizing from any side: Legitimate complaint. Fixed…

>Your expectations don't make it broken. It's not 1990 anymore. All operating systems manufacturers need to understand that the vast majority of users have used Windows and are used to Windows' UI conventions. At the very least, one should offer a way for the Windows user to discover what the new conventions are, rather than having to Google and find websites that other people have made when they made the same transi…

They have of course spurned your counsel about catering to windows users throughout the last decade, all the way from "close the stores and give the money back to the shareholders" to somewhere in the neighborhood of the most successful company ever. All the while thinking it is still 1990 (the significance of which is a little hazy.)

If they didn't follow this advice when they were on life support, what would possess them to follow it now? It's hard to imagine that one could overlook the evidence (here, and everywhere) that if success is the goal, mimicking windows should be closer to a prohibition than a mandate.

Re: Tim O'Reilly: I am really starting to hate Mac OS X.

#355

Post by lzell » Sun, Nov 13, 2011, 5:05 AM UTC

sycren wrote: post #268

kamechan wrote: post #238

Earlier quoted context omitted.

i tend not to use it for this very reason. i've wished, on more than one occasion, that a user could customize this action to be a "maximize vertically", as one could in gnome2. maybe i'm one of the few who actually used this, as it seems to have been phased out in gnome3. but i found it very useful.

I think I use tools like Divvy http://mizage.com/#macdivvy more than I use the zoom icon, it makes it so much easier to position windows..

Spectacle is an awesome open source util for this too: http://spectacle.divisiblebyzero.com

Re: Tim O'Reilly: I am really starting to hate Mac OS X.

#356

Post by eeperson » Sun, Nov 13, 2011, 5:12 AM UTC

Tycho wrote: post #54

megamark16 wrote: post #39

I came from a windows background, tinkered with Linux for a few years on and off, and when I started my current job I was given a Macbook Pro. After a few months of using it I as so frustrated, and found myself spending more and more time in my Ubuntu virtual machine, that when they were ordering new MBPs for the design team I offered to give mine up to a designer and buy a ThinkPad, thus saving the company over $1,0…

Holding alt and arrow keys will move the cursor to the next word (something I miss in every other OS). Holding command and the arrow keys is like the home and end keys. Also if you're on the last line anyway just press down arrow to move cursor to after the last character (also something I miss in other environments). Combine these with shift key to do selections.

On most other OSs, ctrl and arrow keys will move you a word at a time.

Re: Tim O'Reilly: I am really starting to hate Mac OS X.

#357

Post by [deleted] » Sun, Nov 13, 2011, 5:17 AM UTC

earl wrote: post #325

sycren wrote: post #268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think I use tools like Divvy http://mizage.com/#macdivvy more than I use the zoom icon, it makes it so much easier to position windows..

One of Divvy's coolest features is you can build preset window positions and attach them to keyboard chords. So for me, cmd-shift-space brings up divvy then hitting 1 makes the app fill the window, 2 is upper left 2/3 of the screen, 3 is upper right 2/3 of the screen, etc -- I have 7 or 8 presets. Full keyboard control of window position is awesome. It's the best $13 I've ever spent. retailmenot also claims a $20% co…

[deleted]

Re: Tim O'Reilly: I am really starting to hate Mac OS X.

#358

Post by mturmon » Sun, Nov 13, 2011, 5:21 AM UTC

lurker14 wrote: post #118

HSO wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You just proved his point. Granted, it's not candy-color obvious. But for a developer working on Linux , "hard" should represent a different barrier than for Joe Sixpack, yes?

There is a distinction between "doable" and "usable". I should switch to Terminal every time I want to toggle hidden file visibility? Or write a service to install on my Finder toolbar. (I did this, because I'm not Joe Sixpack, but it's still annoying. If I wanted to write my own UI, I wouldn't have gone out and bought one.)

Someone wrote a little app that toggles it, but honestly, if you care that much about it to ask, just leave the hidden files visible all the time. I've found it to be the path of least confusion.

Re: Tim O'Reilly: I am really starting to hate Mac OS X.

#359

Post by subsection1h » Sun, Nov 13, 2011, 5:23 AM UTC

sjs wrote: post #278

megamark16 wrote: post #39

I came from a windows background, tinkered with Linux for a few years on and off, and when I started my current job I was given a Macbook Pro. After a few months of using it I as so frustrated, and found myself spending more and more time in my Ubuntu virtual machine, that when they were ordering new MBPs for the design team I offered to give mine up to a designer and buy a ThinkPad, thus saving the company over $1,0…

If you asked a friend or searched Google instead of writing your problems here perhaps you would have found the solutions. You took time to learn how to use Linux and the shell, why not take some time to learn how to use OS X as well before complaining that it doesn't do what you want? It does do most of the things you mentioned, and when it doesn't it's by design. Resizing from any side: Legitimate complaint. Fixed…

    And Xmonad and the like seem primitive compared to just adding
    tiling goodies (Divvy, SizeUp) to a standard WM to get the best
    of both worlds.

I don't use Xmonad and I don't know what you meant by "the like", but Awesome WM is vastly more powerful[1] than the OS X WM with any add-ons that I've encountered.

[1] http://awesome.naquadah.org/doc/

Re: Tim O'Reilly: I am really starting to hate Mac OS X.

#360

Post by ashishgandhi » Sun, Nov 13, 2011, 5:23 AM UTC

Just to add, holding down the Option key while pressing it alters it behavior to be a maximize button in most apps. Some apps (like Chrome) use the Shift key to get this behavior instead.

I would like things to be more consistent. In fact, if I were in charge, I would want this button to be a maximize button by default, while using the Option (i.e. Alt) key should alter the behavior to the second option which is to resize to the best fit for window content.

But this may need debate since now we have fullscreen mode for apps in Lion.