Review of 17α-ethynylestradiol in water across 32 countries: Estrogenic effects • Hacker News Board

Re: Review of 17α-ethynylestradiol in water across 32 countries: Estrogenic effects

#31

Post by georgia_peach » Sat, Jul 30, 2022, 2:46 PM UTC

marricks wrote: post #27

georgia_peach wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ideology doesn't factor into this. There is something in the water that shouldn't be there, and someone put it there---largely without permission. And what constitutes a "low dose" frequently changes by several orders of magnitude depending on who does the study, and who paid for the study.

I agree! I explicitly state that I don't think random pollutants are good in that comment and there could be other reasons to care about it. I'm merely calling out that the thing most people freak out about with this compound (feminization) is not worth freaking out about .

No post body was provided.

Re: Review of 17α-ethynylestradiol in water across 32 countries: Estrogenic effects

#32

Post by marricks » Sat, Jul 30, 2022, 2:47 PM UTC

goda90 wrote: post #28

marricks wrote: post #23

Apparently everyone is downvoting everything they can because this is a sensitive topic. I'd just like to call out, where feminization is a major concern (US, maybe Europe), there is less than 1ng/L of this compound in water, see elsewhere on this thread for the graphic. The lowest dose of EE2 for trans-women is 2mg a day orally. That means whatever the dosage is in the US it's less than 1/10th* of what trans folk fi…

Is there any accumulation in food? Is it heat stable to survive cooking?

If you live in the US lead* is probably a far greater concern, and that sure does survive cooking.

Re: Review of 17α-ethynylestradiol in water across 32 countries: Estrogenic effects

#33

Post by roflyear » Sat, Jul 30, 2022, 2:48 PM UTC

treeman79 wrote: post #17

SnowHill9902 wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

Quoted post unavailable.

You're not as clever as you think you are.

Re: Review of 17α-ethynylestradiol in water across 32 countries: Estrogenic effects

#34

Post by lazide » Sat, Jul 30, 2022, 2:49 PM UTC

marricks wrote: post #32

goda90 wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there any accumulation in food? Is it heat stable to survive cooking?

If you live in the US lead* is probably a far greater concern, and that sure does survive cooking.

s/led/lead/ ?

Re: Review of 17α-ethynylestradiol in water across 32 countries: Estrogenic effects

#35

Post by oceanplexian » Sat, Jul 30, 2022, 2:50 PM UTC

marricks wrote: post #23

Apparently everyone is downvoting everything they can because this is a sensitive topic. I'd just like to call out, where feminization is a major concern (US, maybe Europe), there is less than 1ng/L of this compound in water, see elsewhere on this thread for the graphic. The lowest dose of EE2 for trans-women is 2mg a day orally. That means whatever the dosage is in the US it's less than 1/10th* of what trans folk fi…

This still sounds concerning to me, if the dose is 2mg for a healthy adult what is it for children and infants? What about babies in the womb?

We saw the same exact thing with PFAS/PFOA, the experts said it was harmless, present in impossibly small quantities, and it would "pass right through you" for literally years. But then it turned out the experts were completely wrong. They found 2000PPM of PFAS in my Mom's well in New Hampshire, out in in the country, miles away from a Teflon factory that leaked into the water supply. She found it after hundreds of dollars of testing when I told her she should be paranoid.

Re: Review of 17α-ethynylestradiol in water across 32 countries: Estrogenic effects

#36

Post by georgia_peach » Sat, Jul 30, 2022, 2:50 PM UTC

marricks wrote: post #32

goda90 wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there any accumulation in food? Is it heat stable to survive cooking?

If you live in the US lead* is probably a far greater concern, and that sure does survive cooking.

This is a diversion, not a direct answer to the question asked.

Re: Review of 17α-ethynylestradiol in water across 32 countries: Estrogenic effects

#37

Post by lazide » Sat, Jul 30, 2022, 2:53 PM UTC

User23 wrote: post #15

marricks wrote: post #8

I'm concerned this is making numbers here because of fear mongers so I want to run the numbers a bit to > The top 10 countries ranked in the order of high to low average EE2 concentration in surface water, were Vietnam, Cambodia, China, Laos, Brazil, Argentina, Kuwait, Thailand, Indonesia and Portugal, with the respective mean concentrations of 27.7, 22.1, 21.5, 21.1, 13.6, 9.6, 9.5, 8.8, 7.6 and 6.6 ng/L Going by Wi…

> I bring this up because of the right wing fear of the "feminization of men." The secular testosterone decline in the west is absolutely incontrovertibly real. The error is looking for a single cause to pin a civilizational scale endocrine disruption event to.

Which can also be related to the mass decrease in exercise and other activities which are known to increase testosterone in men, and rapid increases in stress and sedentary behaviors that are known to decrease it.

Not saying the chemicals aren’t contributing, but our lifestyle is terrible and it has been getting that way rapidly and over a relatively short period of time (a generation).

Re: Review of 17α-ethynylestradiol in water across 32 countries: Estrogenic effects

#38

Post by baldisbasics » Sat, Jul 30, 2022, 2:55 PM UTC

I swear, everyone in my part of the US had massive hair shedding around 2018 or so (man and woman, young and old). We speculated at the time that maybe something in the water supply was causing everyone to lose hair in clumps, and by golly this appears to match with our pet theories.

Re: Review of 17α-ethynylestradiol in water across 32 countries: Estrogenic effects

#39

Post by elil17 » Sat, Jul 30, 2022, 2:57 PM UTC

marricks wrote: post #23

Apparently everyone is downvoting everything they can because this is a sensitive topic. I'd just like to call out, where feminization is a major concern (US, maybe Europe), there is less than 1ng/L of this compound in water, see elsewhere on this thread for the graphic. The lowest dose of EE2 for trans-women is 2mg a day orally. That means whatever the dosage is in the US it's less than 1/10th* of what trans folk fi…

Trans women typically take E2 (bioidentical estrogen), not EE2. EE2 is 100 times more potent than E2 for certain endocrine interactions. Unlike E2, EE2 is not a naturally occurring hormone. E2 causes female puberty when administered to males (except for menstruation), but EE2 isn’t necessarily going to do the same thing because it is a different molecule. While worrying about “feminizing” is probably hype, worrying about possible effects such as infertility seems totally reasonable.

Re: Review of 17α-ethynylestradiol in water across 32 countries: Estrogenic effects

#40

Post by rayiner » Sat, Jul 30, 2022, 2:58 PM UTC

marricks wrote: post #23

Apparently everyone is downvoting everything they can because this is a sensitive topic. I'd just like to call out, where feminization is a major concern (US, maybe Europe), there is less than 1ng/L of this compound in water, see elsewhere on this thread for the graphic. The lowest dose of EE2 for trans-women is 2mg a day orally. That means whatever the dosage is in the US it's less than 1/10th* of what trans folk fi…

> I'd just like to call out, where feminization is a major concern (US, maybe Europe)

What’s that supposed to mean? The article shows the rates in Southeast Asia are 10 times higher than the US. I can assure you that “feminization” would be a much more significant concern there than in the US or Europe.