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How far can you go by train in 5h?

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Re: How far can you go by train in 5h?

#211

Post by bluGill »

wbsss4412 wrote: post #84
js2 wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Italy compared to U.S.: https://www.thetruesize.com/#?borders=1~!MTY3OTMzNjA.NTkxNzE... U.S compared to Europe: https://www.thetruesize.com/#?borders=1~!MTc4NDEwOTE.MjkxMDg... My daughter, visiting home from college this weekend, took Amtrak from Richmond, VA yesterday. She's taking the train back Monday. Without delay, the train takes about 4 hours. Driving takes about 3 hours. Add an extra 15 minutes on each side f…

> Cost of the train is $42 (coach) each way. Cost of gasoline would be ~ $24 each way. The cost of driving is more than just the cost of gasoline.

Not if you already own the car. Then the cost of the car and insurance are sunk costs that do not count. Sure there is a little wear and tear, but that adds just a couple bucks.

If you buy a car/rent for that trip alone, then the cost of driving is far higher. However for most Americans the cost of a car is a sunk cost that cannot be counted. If you live someplace where it is possible to live without a car, then you can make that argument, but most of us do not.

Re: How far can you go by train in 5h?

#212

Post by gwbas1c »

qalmakka wrote: post #22

As a European it boggles my mind seeing how trains are basically non-existent in the USA (just look at Houston station), given how dominant the whole "Wild West" railroad rush is in everybody's immagination. Railroads are super ubiquitous here, and we've to work with a pretty hostile terrain - Italy has lots of mountains, hills, rivers, and yet has one of the best networks in the world. Most of the USA are basically…

Trains "work" in Europe because many European cities are easily walkable. The trains (and other public transportation) comes every 10-15 minutes, so you can leave and arrive when you want to.

Now, consider the convenience of traveling by car: You can leave and arrive when you want to. For a longer journey, you don't need to deal with transferring between trains/busses/whatever, which means that you can keep your luggage in your car until your destination. Chances are, you can park your car at your destination or very close.

As far as sprawl: In some places, building codes require more land. Other times, banks won't lend to build unless the land is worth a certain percentage of the building. For example, when I built my house, the bank wanted the land to be worth about 25% of the value of the house; and the town required that it was so many feet away from the road. That forced my neighborhood to have large, open lawns. (And as much as I love my lawn, I'd be just as happy with a postage stamp yard too.)

There's also the rumor that the US was deliberately built to sprawl after WWII as a way to survive a nuclear attack. I don't know if that's true or a rumor, though.

Re: How far can you go by train in 5h?

#213

Post by bluGill »

melling wrote: post #98
DrBazza wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not convinced high speed rail would ever work in the US due to how entrenched the car culture is, regardless of the terrain. In Europe with we have spoke-and-hub railways - want to get into London? There's almost certainly a local station near you in the suburbs. Then jump on the Eurostar to Paris. Get to Paris, and then get a local line back out to wherever you want to go. Right now, it would have to be airport…

Would never work because of our car culture? I’m going to use my imagination on this one since “never” is a long time. The year 2040. Two technologies combine make never a reality. 1. Maglev trains that travel at 350 miles per hour (600kph) 2. Self-driving taxis Exhibit 1: https://www.cnn.com/travel/amp/china-fastest-maglev-train-in... NY to LA in 10 hours by maglev sometime in this century. The 4 hour maglev between…

China is backing off their high speed maglev trains. While it is possible to make maglev go that fast, wind resistance means it is far to costly. A large airplane (because it runs at 30,000 feet) is not only faster, it uses less energy.

If vacuum trains ever happen, then things change. However those are very expensive to build, and have safety issues. We can solve the engineering problems with safety, but the expense doesn't seem possible)

Re: How far can you go by train in 5h?

#214

Post by eptcyka »

andjd wrote: post #154
qalmakka wrote: post #22

As a European it boggles my mind seeing how trains are basically non-existent in the USA (just look at Houston station), given how dominant the whole "Wild West" railroad rush is in everybody's immagination. Railroads are super ubiquitous here, and we've to work with a pretty hostile terrain - Italy has lots of mountains, hills, rivers, and yet has one of the best networks in the world. Most of the USA are basically…

The USA has a world-class _Freight_ rail network, and almost all existing track in the country is owned by the freight operators, who manage the track to optimize it for freight operations. In many cases, they are openly hostile to passenger service on their tracks. On top of this, most cities in the USA were built (or destroyed and rebuilt) for private cars being the primary mode of transportation. In Europe, one of…

Flying is cheaper than using trains in EU too.

Re: How far can you go by train in 5h?

#215

Post by onionisafruit »

This is very timely. In September I will have four days of down time with my wife in Paris. We want to get out of town but don't know where. This gives us some options.

If anybody here has suggestions where we can spend a few days taking in non-Parisian France, let me know.

Re: How far can you go by train in 5h?

#217

Post by sudosysgen »

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #209
nickbauman wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No it doesn't have a world class freight rail network. The North American rail infra is incredibly primitive. Most of it is "dark territory" (no track sensors), unlike Europe. I used to write rail automation software for a German firm. They were appalled at the state of affairs here. One of the most lucrative rail systems in the US had an average speed of their trains in the single digits MPH!

> Most of it is "dark territory" (no track sensors), unlike Europe. Have you seen the USA? The places where they lack track sensors are basically out in the middle of nowhere with no one around for miles. > One of the most lucrative rail systems in the US had an average speed of their trains in the single digits MPH! That really isn't bad for freight. They optimize freight for throughput, not latency (something passe…

Track sensors are especially useful in they middle of nowhere.

And there are plenty of latency sensitive applications for freight rail which are developed in other places. They don't make sense in the US because the capability isn't there, not because there's no market for it.

Re: How far can you go by train in 5h?

#218

Post by goodpoint »

js2 wrote: post #32
qalmakka wrote: post #22

As a European it boggles my mind seeing how trains are basically non-existent in the USA (just look at Houston station), given how dominant the whole "Wild West" railroad rush is in everybody's immagination. Railroads are super ubiquitous here, and we've to work with a pretty hostile terrain - Italy has lots of mountains, hills, rivers, and yet has one of the best networks in the world. Most of the USA are basically…

Italy compared to U.S.: https://www.thetruesize.com/#?borders=1~!MTY3OTMzNjA.NTkxNzE... U.S compared to Europe: https://www.thetruesize.com/#?borders=1~!MTc4NDEwOTE.MjkxMDg... My daughter, visiting home from college this weekend, took Amtrak from Richmond, VA yesterday. She's taking the train back Monday. Without delay, the train takes about 4 hours. Driving takes about 3 hours. Add an extra 15 minutes on each side f…

The "murica is big" excuse is silly.

What really matter, obviously, is population density. And population density would justify passenger railways on the coasts and in more than half of the US:

https://www.ecoclimax.com/2016/10/population-density-of-worl...

Additionally, it's also based on the flawed assumption that transportation should adapt to the locations of where people live rather than the other way around.

Re: How far can you go by train in 5h?

#220

Post by Yizahi »

Ukraine data is incorrect, before latest invasion we had multiple semi-fast trains reaching 120-140 km/h between regional centers. Though if it is snapshot of current state of affairs then it can be like that, a lot of trains were canceled or slowed due to war.
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