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Senate passes bipartisan bill to subsidize U.S.-made semiconductor chips

washingtonpost.com

281–290 of 489 posts

Re: Senate passes bipartisan bill to subsidize U.S.-made semiconductor chips

#281
post #163

It should be noted that the US decided not to extend the universal free school meals program, because it was "too expensive" at $11B. They also stopped the expanded and early payment of family tax credits, causing a double-whammy hit to poor families (then pile on inflation/food prices, and gas prices). But $50B to large monopolistic companies isn't "too expensive," and we can afford that . Unfortunately 52 senators…

A substantial number of those 52 senators oppose free school meals not because they're "too expensive" but because the policy itself (the government giving free food to children) is something they object to on ideological grounds. A much smaller subset of that group also oppose the government giving free stuff to industry, but in either case the cost is not what they're concerned about.

I’ve stopped believing in the ideology of the average legislator. There are some high profile congresspeople or senators who are deeply ideological, and act according to their ideology, but I feel like that is the exception rather then the rule (hence the high profile).

Rather then ideology most legislators rule by the most persuasive lobbying, this includes people and PACs that pay for their very very expensive campaign funds. And in this case semiconductor monopolies simply has a better performing lobbying campaign then social advocacy groups, so the former gets passed but not the latter.

Note. I don’t believe this listing of democracy is unique to the USA. You see it in Europe as well. However USA is especially prone to this because of lax lobbying laws, lax campaign financing laws while also being one of the least represented democracy in the world (even less represented then non-democracies like China).

Re: Senate passes bipartisan bill to subsidize U.S.-made semiconductor chips

#283

Fab guy here. This is excellent news and much needed, but vigilence is needed to make sure it doesn't end up being devoured by crony corporate agenda and it actually results in favorouble pro-US climate for semiconductor manufacturing. I'd like to share personal experience with how we bankrupted American leadership in cutting edge nodes. Although, it is not lithography related, I was part of a few billion $ ROI progr…

It sounds to me as though that would be closing the barn after the horse has bolted.

A new horse is heading to Vietnam. There is still opportunity to stop it.

Re: Senate passes bipartisan bill to subsidize U.S.-made semiconductor chips

#284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't that how it's supposed to work? The state is supposed to pass laws that represent the will of its constituents. If the majority of the people living in the state are opposed to such a program, then they shouldn't have such a program. The scope of the federal government is supposed to be for coordinating cross-state stuff that states alone can't decide for themselves.

Thats the abortion ruling in a nutshell - return it to the states and let the voters decide. However at the same time we have rulings saying gun rights are a federal issue and a state cannot regulate how permits are given out the way they want (although there are many nuances there), essentially making it a constitutional issue due to the 2nd amendment. So in other words if it's the will of the country we need to pas…

> essentially making it a constitutional issue due to the 2nd amendment.

Yes, because that's how the American constitution works. If you think something else should have similar protections - or if you don't like the second amendment and think it should be repealed - lobby for a new amendment.

Until then, it's the highest law in the land and is on equal footing with any constitutional protection, regardless of your personal policy preferences.

Re: Senate passes bipartisan bill to subsidize U.S.-made semiconductor chips

#285
post #264

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>In 2013, Senator Harry Reid did it for federal judges (and not supreme court judges). Yes, it was an extremely aggressive and short sighted thing for him to do. Most people don't know this story though, so it seems the Democratic Party gets a pass. Here's McConnell lambasting Reid about it in 2013. https://www.c-span.org/video/?316395-12/minority-leader-mcco... >It appears to have led to an era of unprecedented judi…

No it was a wise and practical decision. And the fillibuster has always been a stupid accident of the rules. It delayed civil rights bills by over a decade Everyone knew that McConnell was lying and would have overturned the fillibuster on judges the second a supreme court fillibuster started. And we would have gotten the same extremist supreme court that laughs at restaint and takes away fundamental rights

Apparently he had the option to do it under Bush when Democrats were obstructing Bush's nominees to the federal courts, and he chose not to, so the evidence suggests that he would not have just removed the filibuster for the fun of it.

Re: Senate passes bipartisan bill to subsidize U.S.-made semiconductor chips

#286
post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tariffs on products we don't have immediate domestic manufacturing capacity for will hurt the economy in the short term, which is not a great move during a period of rising inflation. It's a tough decision though, because it does feel like the better move for the long term.

> Tariffs on products we don't have immediate domestic manufacturing capacity for will hurt the economy in the short term I suppose you could announce tariffs which will take place 5 years down the line? And ramp it up over time?

[deleted]

Re: Senate passes bipartisan bill to subsidize U.S.-made semiconductor chips

#287
post #254

Fairly cynical comments on this thread, many trying to uphold American values like "free market", "protectionism is bad", "what about the consumer", "not from my tax money". I find those remarks pretty naive. Every major power block heavily subsidizes strategic industries, now and forever. It's in no way new or remarkable, nor does it violate some principle. Most of the above concepts are pure fiction. Semiconductors…

Here's my cynical take: This bill will subsidize a lot of jobs when we already have zero slack in our labor market. I think it's an excellent target for spending and would have a positive multiplier in normal times but in 2022 this seems likely to just goose inflation another inch.

Unless we actually start seeing cyclical job losses finally hit right when this money starts being spent. Which is entirely possible.

Re: Senate passes bipartisan bill to subsidize U.S.-made semiconductor chips

#288
post #268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In 2013, Senator Harry Reid did it for federal judges (and not supreme court judges). At the time, McConnell told them that if they killed the filibuster for federal judges, he would kill it for supreme court justices. In 2017, he followed through on his promise, the orange fool appointed 3 justices, and now Roe v. Wade has been overturned. It would not be crazy to link the overturning of Roe to the 2013 decision of…

It would be absolutely insane to link overturning Roe to Reid's decision. Everyone already knew McConnell would have gotten rid of it anyway the second a supreme court justice was fillibustered. Look at his actions in the Garland and Barrett nominations, compared to that getting rid of the fillibuster for judges is peanuts. The only mistake Reid made was not to do away with the fillibuster fully

If you threaten to do something and don't follow through on your threats, they have no more meaning.

McConnell and his party apparently had a similar situation 10 years before and did not throw out the filibuster.

Re: Senate passes bipartisan bill to subsidize U.S.-made semiconductor chips

#289
post #264

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>In 2013, Senator Harry Reid did it for federal judges (and not supreme court judges). Yes, it was an extremely aggressive and short sighted thing for him to do. Most people don't know this story though, so it seems the Democratic Party gets a pass. Here's McConnell lambasting Reid about it in 2013. https://www.c-span.org/video/?316395-12/minority-leader-mcco... >It appears to have led to an era of unprecedented judi…

No it was a wise and practical decision. And the fillibuster has always been a stupid accident of the rules. It delayed civil rights bills by over a decade Everyone knew that McConnell was lying and would have overturned the fillibuster on judges the second a supreme court fillibuster started. And we would have gotten the same extremist supreme court that laughs at restaint and takes away fundamental rights

>No it was a wise and practical decision.

Well the Democrats just lost all chance of any new gun control and will probably have some gun control repealed. Not only that, they lost the power of Democrat controlled states to enact gun control at the state level and will have much of state gun control repealed. They completely lost the right to abortion at the federal/constitutional level as well. What did they gain for that immense cost? Some federal judges back in 2013. If you think that was wise and in no way short sighted, I really don't know what to say.

Re: Senate passes bipartisan bill to subsidize U.S.-made semiconductor chips

#290

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m all for healthy free lunches for poor kids. Is it really necessary to give free meals to all Palo Alto kids independent of financial status? https://www.paloaltoonline.com/news/2022/06/19/palo-alto-uni...

The idea behind it is not to embarrass the poor kids who need the free lunch by making lunch just free.

And then the government gets to decide what the lunches are for everyone.
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