Logistics, How Did They Do It, Part I: The Problem • Hacker News Board

Re: Logistics, How Did They Do It, Part I: The Problem

#11

Post by brazzy » Tue, Jul 26, 2022, 5:34 PM UTC

dv_dt wrote: post #8

herodotus wrote: post #2

Are there any computer or table top war games that deal in a somewhat realistic way with logistics?

I don't think it's a war game per se, but wars can occur in Dwarf Fortress. And there can definitely be some very detailed logistics involved.

Completely different kind of logistics, both in scope and in focus. in Dwarf fortress, it's about equipping, training and supporting a double- or low triple digit number of soldiers operating in or very near their base.

The logistics we're talking about concern the problem of having about a hundred or even a thousand times more soldiers move large distances away from their base, and avoid having them starve.

Re: Logistics, How Did They Do It, Part I: The Problem

#12

Post by ca7 » Tue, Jul 26, 2022, 5:41 PM UTC

allturtles wrote: post #9

herodotus wrote: post #2

Are there any computer or table top war games that deal in a somewhat realistic way with logistics?

The Operational Combat Series[0] is famous within the hex-and-counter wargame community for its logistic systems. It deals only with mid-twentieth century conflict. Supply point counters are brought near the front by land,sea, or air transport, and then consumed by troops to fight. More recently, the Levy and Campaign series[1] tries to seriously address the kind of pre-modern logistical problems that are discussed b…

Regarding OCS, supply is broken down mainly into ammo and fuel. No ammo = no combat. No fuel = no movement. OCS makes you commit to operations you plan to perform in the future as you have to build up supply in an area (and then have a logistics network to "throw" the supply to units) to launch operations. The opponent is also doing this at the same time.

Re: Logistics, How Did They Do It, Part I: The Problem

#13

Post by Phenomenit » Tue, Jul 26, 2022, 5:45 PM UTC

I would love to have this wonderful blog recorded as a podcast.

Re: Logistics, How Did They Do It, Part I: The Problem

#14

Post by dEnigma » Tue, Jul 26, 2022, 6:17 PM UTC

nullstyle wrote: post #3

herodotus wrote: post #2

Are there any computer or table top war games that deal in a somewhat realistic way with logistics?

Foxhole entrenched is a game to look at

Foxhole was also the first thing that popped into my head. I'm not sure how "realistic" you can call it, but there are certainly some interesting interactions/dynamics displayed when it comes to logistics.

https://store.steampowered.com/app/505460/Foxhole/

Re: Logistics, How Did They Do It, Part I: The Problem

#15

Post by tekla » Tue, Jul 26, 2022, 6:37 PM UTC

herodotus wrote: post #2

Are there any computer or table top war games that deal in a somewhat realistic way with logistics?

Eve Online. Try fighting a war without freighters full of fuel, ammo, and replacement ships. Its a full time job by itself.

Re: Logistics, How Did They Do It, Part I: The Problem

#16

Post by waynesonfire » Tue, Jul 26, 2022, 6:51 PM UTC

tekla wrote: post #15

herodotus wrote: post #2

Are there any computer or table top war games that deal in a somewhat realistic way with logistics?

Eve Online. Try fighting a war without freighters full of fuel, ammo, and replacement ships. Its a full time job by itself.

> Its a full time job by itself.

Indeed, the game is a full time job.

Re: Logistics, How Did They Do It, Part I: The Problem

#17

Post by Khoth » Tue, Jul 26, 2022, 7:08 PM UTC

Phenomenit wrote: post #13

I would love to have this wonderful blog recorded as a podcast.

Not technically a podcast, but if you want to listen to them, someone has recorded themselves reading (most of) the posts: https://www.youtube.com/c/AGreatDivorce/videos

Re: Logistics, How Did They Do It, Part I: The Problem

#18

Post by antonymy » Tue, Jul 26, 2022, 7:22 PM UTC

I underestimated how much of warfare was about grain shipments until I read Caesar's Commentaries on the Gallic Wars. Now it's all I think about whenever I see pre-modern armies depicted in media, is where they get their bread and corn.

Re: Logistics, How Did They Do It, Part I: The Problem

#19

Post by [deleted] » Tue, Jul 26, 2022, 8:07 PM UTC

herodotus wrote: post #2

Are there any computer or table top war games that deal in a somewhat realistic way with logistics?

[deleted]

Re: Logistics, How Did They Do It, Part I: The Problem

#20

Post by Animats » Tue, Jul 26, 2022, 8:42 PM UTC

We can see this today with Russia's early Ukraine campaign. The attacking armored forces moved fast at first, but outran their logistics tail. Large military operations have reasonably well defended rear bases, a moving attack front, and a "communications region" in between. The communications region is vulnerable; the attackers don't yet have full control of that region. Both air and ground attacks on the communications region were used in Ukraine. If the tip of the spear can be slowed down, the attackers are forced into a battle that uses more resources. If the defender can prevent those resources from moving forward, the attackers run out of fuel and ammo. Towards the end of the attack on Kyiv, Ukrainian troops were finding "lost orcs", Russian soldiers separated from their units. Some were just disarmed and told "Russia is that way, start walking".

So, having failed at a complicated, fast campaign, Russia has moved to a simpler form - bring up many troops and artillery and slowly pound the opposition into rubble. It's like WWI. That kind of war can go on for years if enough resources are available. It seems to be working for Russia.