I just want to point out that it's probably not the best choice to move anywhere near the equator.
Ask HN: Leaving Germany – where to find quality of life as experienced engineer?
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Re: Ask HN: Leaving Germany – where to find quality of life as experienced engineer?
#52Earlier quoted context omitted.
> which to us especially means escaping crazy black/white discussions, But the decision to leave instead of trying to engage and improve things is pretty black and white mentality in itself, isn't it?
> But the decision to leave instead of trying to engage and improve things is pretty black and white mentality in itself, isn't it? You've got a point here. Yes, it's giving up. And to be honest, we both gave up. But since we're responsible for our little one, we still try to make the best of it, hence want to restart somewhere else. But I get your point. It's just that we both spent all of our energy over the last 2…
If that's the case then maybe instead of emigrating (which comes with a new set of problems) you may want to consider simply scaling back your ambition to 'improve things in all sorts of different dimensions' because you and your s.o. are just two individuals against an immense backdrop with huge inertia.
The people we look up to because they are typically painted as the agents of social change tend to be the ones who were there at the right moment: they were catalysts rather than major forces and their relatively small contribution caused a much larger force to become unlocked. But for that to happen that force already has to be there, for each and every one of those there are thousands (millions?) who tried the same thing at a different point in time and failed.
Re: Ask HN: Leaving Germany – where to find quality of life as experienced engineer?
#53I've never lived there myself (just visited) and I'm not sure to what extent they would meet your politics/tax criteria, but Australia seems to have some happy ex-pats there, and New Zealand.
I've personally wondered about Melbourne or somewhere for myself at times...
Re: Ask HN: Leaving Germany – where to find quality of life as experienced engineer?
#54Malta might be an option due to climate, english and lots of foreigners living there, but i have no idea about taxes. Cyprus also.
European countries are actually a very good option. Moving there is no problem at all, since we simply can move anywhere in Europe. It would have to be somewhere in the south tho, since we're looking for a much more relaxed lifestyle. We've never been to Malta or Cyprus so far, but both get onto our list. Thank you!
Have a look at Greece, I've found it extremely welcoming and reasonably affordable.
Re: Ask HN: Leaving Germany – where to find quality of life as experienced engineer?
#55"politics, social life, social net" I think it will be hard to recommend depending on your exact positions on these. I think it will be difficult to recommend a place with low taxes and robust safety net. Generally the taxes are what Pay for a safety net. On that note, the US could be an option (southern states) for you since the taxes tend to be lower than other developed nations. The safety net is fairly robust, bu…
> "politics, social life, social net" > I think it will be hard to recommend depending on your exact positions on these. We're both educated and open towards a liberal, future oriented society. Same goes for paying taxes, since the "overall standards" in Germany are still very high. Nevertheless, the last 10 years spit society, family and friends. Hardly any healthy discussion culture, you're either on the one or the…
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Re: Ask HN: Leaving Germany – where to find quality of life as experienced engineer?
#56> meaningless to get into the details The problem is that your stances on these impact recommendations. Are you taxed too high and think the social safety net costs too much? Or do you need the social safety net and are complaining about rich people not paying?
Good point. Actually we're not complaining about our high tax rates. It's just that we do not benefit from the state no more. As someone running my own business since 1999 and work as a freelancer, I never paid into the german social net. So I have no expectations there, have a private health insurance, take care for my pension by saving and investing and cover most risks with private insurance. That's fine, because it was my choice. The point is, that from a certain income your income tax get's crazily high. Combined with other taxes everyone else also pays I end up working for taxes around 70% of my time. That WOULD be ok, if the state / government at least provided me with working infra and services, if kids care would be ok'ish (as promised), school standards were high (they once were) and infra like public transport, railway and air transport were not foo'd up beyond repair. I can accept poor conditions, if my taxes are low and I can save / invest for my pension. I can also accept good conditions and therefor high taxes. In Germany it's high taxes and bad conditions ... at least for us.
Re: Ask HN: Leaving Germany – where to find quality of life as experienced engineer?
#57Sounds like you should/want just move out of Berlin, not necessarily Germany. Sure, the tax situation and climate is basically the same everywhere, but if you want quality of live I'd recommend somewhere near or between Oldenburg and Emden in Lower Saxony. Once you settled in basically everything east of Bremen and south of Osnabrück will feel like a different country. I basically had the same situation for decades and have been everywhere from north to south and west to east, from small towns to big cities. There's exceptions everywhere of course.
Re: Ask HN: Leaving Germany – where to find quality of life as experienced engineer?
#58what are your top 3 issues with berlin? germany and berlin always seemed to offer great quality of life. i’m from europe too. how can you not afford a house in germany with a 200k/year salary? for less than 500k you should be able to find something nice? even if you pay 50% tax. and you have 2 incomes.
in the US real estate on the east and west coast is insanely expensive and 1.5MM plus for a very basic house. nothing fancy and lower quality than in europe.
so the cheaper real estate is in the midwest where there is little infrastructure and very little access to the cultural systems like exist in europe.
i am on the west coast and love it here. but it has been extremely stressful and i will probably not be able to afford a house until i win the lottery or the startup game or maybe a very high up FAANG position. europe is just a different pace and stress level.
i will add to this that professional discrimination of women in europe is much less than in the US IMHO. important if your wife is working.
Re: Ask HN: Leaving Germany – where to find quality of life as experienced engineer?
#59Just move out of that shithole berlin and than reevaluate. Join SAP and move to waldorf for example.
> Just move out of that shithole berlin and than reevaluate.
:) get your point and love it. As someone born and raised in Berlin the decision is everything but easy. Love-hate-relationship I'd say. But if we leave, we also want to escape the current, very heated "social mood", which makes Germany not an option. But SAP is actually quite a good hint. Thanks!
Re: Ask HN: Leaving Germany – where to find quality of life as experienced engineer?
#60Come on over to Greece and take a break.