Ford's answer to EV supply chain hell: Cheaper batteries
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Re: Ford's answer to EV supply chain hell: Cheaper batteries
#2I don’t think heavier batteries with less battery life are gonna do much for Americans.
Not unless we can get into small vehicles real quick- and given that the chicken tax has been imposed by executive order since 1964 I don’t see that happening.
Re: Ford's answer to EV supply chain hell: Cheaper batteries
#3I don’t think heavier batteries with less battery life are gonna do much for Americans. Not unless we can get into small vehicles real quick- and given that the chicken tax has been imposed by executive order since 1964 I don’t see that happening.
For others who didn't know:
Re: Ford's answer to EV supply chain hell: Cheaper batteries
#4This is huge. To date, Tesla has been the only non-Chinese manufacturer talking iron. LFP is often touted for being cheaper than NMC, but given growing insecurity around battery-grade nickel supplies, using the far-more-prevalent iron and phosphate isn’t just about cheaper cars. It’s about having cars to sell in the first place.
With respect to range anxiety, pretty much every EV in the 200 to 300-mile range is sold out. (I was looking.) And Ford deploying LFP doesn’t mean it has to go 100% LFP in every vehicle. Just having the extra vehicles will win it market share.
(As to why now, the last of the patents in a critical suite expired in April [1]. Steve LeVine writes excellently to this topic [2].)
[1] https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1167178/000104746912...
[2] https://subscriptions.theinformation.com/newsletters/the-ele...
Re: Ford's answer to EV supply chain hell: Cheaper batteries
#5How much room for improvement is left on the consumption side? Electric cars seem to require around 15-20kWh/100km. Can we get that below 10 for regular highway driving, say at 130km/h? What are the numbers for city driving like?
Re: Ford's answer to EV supply chain hell: Cheaper batteries
#6Happy Ford is using more environmentally friendly Iron based LFP batteries. Cobalt in more traditional batteries is neurotoxic for humans and the mining of Cobalt is dirty. Very good that a large car manufacturer such as Ford is switching to Iron LFP. You should be able to fast charge LFP which will compensate for the lesser energy density. Since lfp is more stable they should be able to take the charging better than cobalt-based chemistries. Also Iron lfp is a more stable chemistry than cobalt-based so far less likely for battery fires.
Re: Ford's answer to EV supply chain hell: Cheaper batteries
#7How much room for improvement is left on the consumption side? Electric cars seem to require around 15-20kWh/100km. Can we get that below 10 for regular highway driving, say at 130km/h? What are the numbers for city driving like?
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Re: Ford's answer to EV supply chain hell: Cheaper batteries
#8I don’t think heavier batteries with less battery life are gonna do much for Americans. Not unless we can get into small vehicles real quick- and given that the chicken tax has been imposed by executive order since 1964 I don’t see that happening.
I don't see how a tariff on larger vehicles means that the US market can't switch to smaller vehicles. Isn't it even the opposite because smaller cheaper cars can be directly imported from overseas? I agree the US market is incapable of switching to smaller cars in the near future, but i doubt the Chicken Tax has much to do with it.
Re: Ford's answer to EV supply chain hell: Cheaper batteries
#9I don’t think heavier batteries with less battery life are gonna do much for Americans. Not unless we can get into small vehicles real quick- and given that the chicken tax has been imposed by executive order since 1964 I don’t see that happening.
I don't see how a tariff on larger vehicles means that the US market can't switch to smaller vehicles. Isn't it even the opposite because smaller cheaper cars can be directly imported from overseas? I agree the US market is incapable of switching to smaller cars in the near future, but i doubt the Chicken Tax has much to do with it.
The chicken tax is a tax on small trucks, not large ones
Re: Ford's answer to EV supply chain hell: Cheaper batteries
#10Happy Ford is using more environmentally friendly Iron based LFP batteries. Cobalt in more traditional batteries is neurotoxic for humans and the mining of Cobalt is dirty. Very good that a large car manufacturer such as Ford is switching to Iron LFP. You should be able to fast charge LFP which will compensate for the lesser energy density. Since lfp is more stable they should be able to take the charging better than…
Having driven the 2021 Model 3 Standard Range with LFP Batteries from China:
It charged much slower and had worse performance degradation in winter.
This might be due to the software limitations Tesla put on the BMC, but since then it didn't improve by much.
I wouldn't expect LFP be the panacea, but it should make EVs more affordable and is definetly in the "good enough" range for most families.