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The Real Reason Italy Sucks at the Startup Game

programmingzen.com

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Re: The Real Reason Italy Sucks at the Startup Game

#11

Post by tomelders »

I really like that graph. I suspect the Chinese may well be right in their assumption that "success is outside of their control", but few other countries have the same excuses.

There could be a case to be made that countries should monitor that metric very closely and work hard to improve their "Yes to No" ratio.

Also, having lived and worked in Italy, my number 1 reason for setting up my company (which failed) in the UK was the insane level of bureaucracy in Italy. It's farcical, near impossible to navigate and anyone who's prepared to deal with that level of antiquated incompetence, corruption and inefficiency needs their head looking at. It's a beautiful country, but it's rotten to the core.

Re: The Real Reason Italy Sucks at the Startup Game

#13

Post by phatbyte »

Unfortunately this applies to Spain, Greece and my home country Portugal. South european countries have the same base mentality when it come to entrepreneurship, you either get mocked/ignored/stigmatized for failing or you get jealousy/ignored when you succeeded.

Also, we don't have the mentality of "self-made man" and "go get it", most of our population expect everything from the government. They get a degree and expect to get a job the next day just because.

I have serious arguments with family members and friends regarding this, because I'm the totally opposite, I strive to succeeded and I'm happy and inspired when I see someone else succeeding. I don't want to be in a safe job for the rest of my life, I want to be in a limbo all the time, that will make me push forward and fight to a have a better life. And to be honest I'm doing a lot better than most of the people here, even if I don't have a "stable" job.

I'm currently working as freelancer for companies outside portugal, and I've just funded my company in the US. I expect to get away from here next year. I just can't stand this mentality

Re: The Real Reason Italy Sucks at the Startup Game

#14

Post by program »

I am italian, I have a full-time job in an IT private company, I own an house and I know why you can't create a startup in Italy: money, burocracy and taxes.

In Italy banks or companies will never invest money in your startup if you can't cover at least all the money you need in 4/5 years. If you dare to found a new company and you fail then your life is destroyed. You are tagged as "cattivo pagatore" (bad payer) and you will never obtain money in form of loans.

Italy is a very bad place if you want to make something innovative.

Re: The Real Reason Italy Sucks at the Startup Game

#15

Post by davidw »

program wrote: post #14

I am italian, I have a full-time job in an IT private company, I own an house and I know why you can't create a startup in Italy: money, burocracy and taxes. In Italy banks or companies will never invest money in your startup if you can't cover at least all the money you need in 4/5 years. If you dare to found a new company and you fail then your life is destroyed. You are tagged as "cattivo pagatore" (bad payer) and…

BTW, I hope you and all the other Italians reading have taken a moment to sign the petition (and help in any other ways that you can) here:

http://www.srlfacile.org

What with the crisis, these sorts of reforms actually have a chance.

Re: The Real Reason Italy Sucks at the Startup Game

#16

Post by Symmetry »

oscardelben wrote: post #3

I agree about the mentality problem, though I think it's mostly due ignorance in general and values that are often toward the wrong thing. Regarding taxes, it's pretty ridiculous, I would never encourage people to open a business here if they can avoid it. I'm moving to the US next year and I can't wait to stop paying the ridiculous amount of money (in proportion of what I earn) that I pay now as a consultant. I thin…

Regarding taxes, I was surprised to read today that corportations in Italy, if they actually complied with every law, would be paying a 68.6% tax rate. Still not as bad as a few countries in Africa where the offical tax rates are well over 100%, though.

http://marginalrevolution.com/marginalrevolution/2011/11/ita...

Re: The Real Reason Italy Sucks at the Startup Game

#18

Post by italophil »

program wrote: post #14

I am italian, I have a full-time job in an IT private company, I own an house and I know why you can't create a startup in Italy: money, burocracy and taxes. In Italy banks or companies will never invest money in your startup if you can't cover at least all the money you need in 4/5 years. If you dare to found a new company and you fail then your life is destroyed. You are tagged as "cattivo pagatore" (bad payer) and…

You blaming it on outside forces (money, burocracy and taxes) just validates one of the points in the article.

I am German, working some years for FIAT, and did my PhD in Italy, but left right after graduation for the US. The article perfectly summarizes the reasons I didn't want to stay and start something in Italy.

Re: The Real Reason Italy Sucks at the Startup Game

#19

Post by metachris »

oscardelben wrote: post #3

I agree about the mentality problem, though I think it's mostly due ignorance in general and values that are often toward the wrong thing. Regarding taxes, it's pretty ridiculous, I would never encourage people to open a business here if they can avoid it. I'm moving to the US next year and I can't wait to stop paying the ridiculous amount of money (in proportion of what I earn) that I pay now as a consultant. I thin…

I live in Austria and have to pay about 40 to 50% tax on any income. At least I know it's going towards things such as free universities, free healthcare, unemployment insurances for everyone. Makes the pill a bit easier to swallow.

Re: The Real Reason Italy Sucks at the Startup Game

#20

Post by pdelgallego »

phatbyte wrote: post #13

Unfortunately this applies to Spain, Greece and my home country Portugal. South european countries have the same base mentality when it come to entrepreneurship, you either get mocked/ignored/stigmatized for failing or you get jealousy/ignored when you succeeded. Also, we don't have the mentality of "self-made man" and "go get it", most of our population expect everything from the government. They get a degree and ex…

Iberian fellow here. How do you manage to funded your company in the US?
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