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South Carolina bill outlaws websites that tell how to get an abortion

washingtonpost.com

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Re: South Carolina bill outlaws websites that tell how to get an abortion

#191

Post by ChrisLomont »

carbadtraingood wrote: post #152
ChrisLomont wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>On social issues, you could be arrested for being gay. You could legally be denied housing loans based on your race. It was considered impossible to rape your spouse. I could continue this paragraph Yet all of those were given protection based on Constitutional arguments, right? With no change needed to specifically add a new tiny rule to the Constitution for each single change in societal beliefs, right? >If you be…

We disagree, fundamentally. Amicably, I'm going to suggest these threads have run their course. Handshake and agree to disagree?

Agree

Re: South Carolina bill outlaws websites that tell how to get an abortion

#192

Post by user3939382 »

dalyons wrote: post #37
user3939382 wrote: post #29

Quoted post unavailable.

you can keep your puritan personal take on this, and live by it all you want. All the rest of us ask is that you don't try and impose your restrictive personal beliefs on us, directly or via appartus of the state. That shouldnt be controversial.

Unlike religion, government policies are derived not from an absolute source of truth but are related only to the values of the people being governed by them. So, you know, may the best man win.

Re: South Carolina bill outlaws websites that tell how to get an abortion

#193

Post by 32163704 »

JamesBarney wrote: post #184
32163704 wrote: post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> that frees the other side to ignore the rules on issues they deem sufficiently important to them, and it goes quickly downhill from there. We’re already there. That’s already happened. Stare decisis — remember when all the justices who just ruled to overturn Roe called it “settled law”? Remember when the Republican Senate refused to consider Obama’s Supreme Court nominee? Remember when the courts gutted the voting…

The principle of Stare decisis does not mean the supreme court can't overturn any decision it's ever made. It's routinely overturned previous decisions, many times overturning previous conservative rulings to put in place liberal ones. If you watch this youtube video of Kavanaugh answering questions I never get the idea that he says he won't overturn Roe v Wage, or that it is a binding or super precedent. https://www…

Sure. When prior decisions are “unworkable or are badly reasoned,” then the Supreme Court may not follow precedent, and this is “particularly true in constitutional cases.” [0] But the prior decision was certainly workable, since it had been working for almost 50 years. And it certainly wasn’t too badly reasoned, since the same reasoning was applied to many other cases — situations which also were quite workable, since they were an expansion of rights, not a circumscription of them. If anything, the court created an unworkable situation by ruling the way it did; it has created chaos in the medical field for half of the states.

[0]https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/stare_decisis

Re: South Carolina bill outlaws websites that tell how to get an abortion

#194

Post by SauciestGNU »

bedast wrote: post #120
TrackerFF wrote: post #20

Just waiting for that batshit bounty law (in Texas) to spread to other states. Basically, any citizen can sue anyone if they suspect aiding or abetting an abortion. There are seemingly no recourses either, for the defendant. If successful, the plaintiff can be awarded up to $10k - therefore a bounty law. So by that logic, you should be able to sue the owner of a website - as long as it is within the state, because th…

The bounty law was implemented while Roe v Wade was in effect. Texas also passed a trigger law that, essentially, supersedes the bounty law by changing it from a civil matter to a criminal matter. Since SCOTUS overturned Roe v Wade, the trigger law goes into effect. Prior to SCOTUS overturning Roe v Wade, other states were preparing their own bounty laws. I believe those have since been abandoned in favor of criminal…

If bounties are ok for constitutionally protected rights (which abortion was when the bounty law was upheld), what's to stop blue jurisdictions from placing bounties on behaviors such as voting for Republicans or attending church? It's not a path we want to go down as a society, but we absolutely must defend ourselves from theocratic fascists.

Re: South Carolina bill outlaws websites that tell how to get an abortion

#195

Post by JamesBarney »

32163704 wrote: post #193
JamesBarney wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The principle of Stare decisis does not mean the supreme court can't overturn any decision it's ever made. It's routinely overturned previous decisions, many times overturning previous conservative rulings to put in place liberal ones. If you watch this youtube video of Kavanaugh answering questions I never get the idea that he says he won't overturn Roe v Wage, or that it is a binding or super precedent. https://www…

Sure. When prior decisions are “unworkable or are badly reasoned,” then the Supreme Court may not follow precedent, and this is “particularly true in constitutional cases.” [0] But the prior decision was certainly workable, since it had been working for almost 50 years. And it certainly wasn’t too badly reasoned, since the same reasoning was applied to many other cases — situations which also were quite workable, sin…

There are plenty of constitutional scholars (many who are liberal and pro-choice) who believe Roe v Wade was badly reasoned like Akhil Reed Amar.

Re: South Carolina bill outlaws websites that tell how to get an abortion

#196

Post by SamoyedFurFluff »

lurquer wrote: post #168
powerhour wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do we decide which cases to prosecute? Do we convene a grand jury for every miscarriage? Do you have any idea how many investigations this would be per year? If you don't investigate every miscarriage, what's the criteria for getting the state involved? Do you wait for family or neighbors to report a crime? Do you track medical appointments and make a judgement as to when a birth was expected and didn't happen? I…

>…do we convene a grand jury… Every felony charge goes through a grand jury. Indeed, every death is investigated to some extent. Every county has a coroner, some states have full-blown inquests after each death. Do you think when grandma dies of old age she’s just taken to a funeral home and that’s that? There’s more to it. If something looks suspicious, it’s kicked up to the next level. If questions remain, it’s kic…

Before roe v wade the complications of botched self-administered abortions was one of the major causes of early death and disability of women. I don’t think it’s nearly as simple as one would believe, because even the Bible doesn’t recognize a fetus as being alive until well into the second or third trimester.

Re: South Carolina bill outlaws websites that tell how to get an abortion

#197

Post by randomhodler84 »

user3939382 wrote: post #192
dalyons wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

you can keep your puritan personal take on this, and live by it all you want. All the rest of us ask is that you don't try and impose your restrictive personal beliefs on us, directly or via appartus of the state. That shouldnt be controversial.

Unlike religion, government policies are derived not from an absolute source of truth but are related only to the values of the people being governed by them. So, you know, may the best man win.

Absolute truth. Lol. Buddy. God doesn’t exist, you have been lied to all your life by controlling beings who wish to fill you mind with ancient fairy tales to keep you in submission. Religion is a refuge for the ignorant.

Hacker news is not the place to be spreading fear, it is a house of science and engineering. We like logic, and freedom. You are advocating for ignorance and superstition.

Re: South Carolina bill outlaws websites that tell how to get an abortion

#198

Post by user3939382 »

randomhodler84 wrote: post #197
user3939382 wrote: post #192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unlike religion, government policies are derived not from an absolute source of truth but are related only to the values of the people being governed by them. So, you know, may the best man win.

Absolute truth. Lol. Buddy. God doesn’t exist, you have been lied to all your life by controlling beings who wish to fill you mind with ancient fairy tales to keep you in submission. Religion is a refuge for the ignorant. Hacker news is not the place to be spreading fear, it is a house of science and engineering. We like logic, and freedom. You are advocating for ignorance and superstition.

For what it’s worth Russell’s Teapot is an illogical, fallacious analogy, and almost always the reason atheists think they’re smarter than everyone else.

Re: South Carolina bill outlaws websites that tell how to get an abortion

#199

Post by IIsi50MHz »

softcactus wrote: post #137
linuxftw wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't pretend to know what is best for everyone nor dictate my morals to them. So if SC thinks they should have a law to do whatever, that's their business. If the people living there don't like it, they should work to change the law, or start lynching politicians, whichever is easier, that's for the people of SC to decide. As for the people not in South Carolina, they should work to pass an amendment or secede fro…

> As for the people not in South Carolina, they should work to pass an amendment or secede from the union, those are the only legal options if you believe in how the federal government is supposed to work It's not legal to secede from the US, we fought an entire war because it was not a right of the states. Most of what you say ignores the reality of our political system, voter suppression, who draw districts, filibu…

Didn't Texas join the union via constitutional ammendment? One that gives them unilateral right to secede? Or do I mismemember my civics classes?

Re: South Carolina bill outlaws websites that tell how to get an abortion

#200

Post by randomhodler84 »

user3939382 wrote: post #198
randomhodler84 wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Absolute truth. Lol. Buddy. God doesn’t exist, you have been lied to all your life by controlling beings who wish to fill you mind with ancient fairy tales to keep you in submission. Religion is a refuge for the ignorant. Hacker news is not the place to be spreading fear, it is a house of science and engineering. We like logic, and freedom. You are advocating for ignorance and superstition.

For what it’s worth Russell’s Teapot is an illogical, fallacious analogy, and almost always the reason atheists think they’re smarter than everyone else.

Narrator: they were.
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